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Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 23rd 16, 09:40 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Alycidon
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Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

QUOTE:

"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution more effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing their own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling and 'not choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti....html#comments
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  #2  
Old February 23rd 16, 10:16 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Nick[_4_]
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Posts: 1,323
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On 23/02/2016 08:40, Alycidon wrote:
QUOTE:

"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution more effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing their own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling and 'not choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti....html#comments


But how many people's elbows has pollution jostled whilst riding on the
pavement?

The politicians who promoted diesel in 2001 should be shot. Its not like
it wasn't obvious at the time.
  #3  
Old February 23rd 16, 10:32 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Alycidon
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Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On Tuesday, 23 February 2016 09:17:07 UTC, Nick wrote:
On 23/02/2016 08:40, Alycidon wrote:
QUOTE:

"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution more effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing their own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling and 'not choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti....html#comments


But how many people's elbows has pollution jostled whilst riding on the
pavement?

The politicians who promoted diesel in 2001 should be shot. Its not like
it wasn't obvious at the time.


There are idiots out there who imagine that pure CO2 is spewing out of car tailpipes and there is nothing to worry about as AGW is a myth.

When challenged to state how they can burn Sulphur and Nitrogen and get pure CO2, they go quiet. I suppose they are too busy converting Lead into Gold to reply.

  #4  
Old February 23rd 16, 10:41 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Nick[_4_]
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Posts: 1,323
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On 23/02/2016 09:32, Alycidon wrote:
On Tuesday, 23 February 2016 09:17:07 UTC, Nick wrote:
On 23/02/2016 08:40, Alycidon wrote:
QUOTE:

"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution more effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing their own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling and 'not choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti....html#comments


But how many people's elbows has pollution jostled whilst riding on the
pavement?

The politicians who promoted diesel in 2001 should be shot. Its not like
it wasn't obvious at the time.


There are idiots out there who imagine that pure CO2 is spewing out of car tailpipes and there is nothing to worry about as AGW is a myth.

When challenged to state how they can burn Sulphur and Nitrogen and get pure CO2, they go quiet. I suppose they are too busy converting Lead into Gold to reply.


AIUI it isn't the sulphur and nitrogen that cause the problem but
particulates.

I'm not giving a radical change argument. Diesel particulate matter
causes more problems than petrol. To imagine Diesel is more
environmentally friendly due to lower CO2 is idiocy.
  #5  
Old February 23rd 16, 11:03 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Peter Keller[_3_]
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Posts: 8,736
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 09:41:18 +0000, Nick wrote:

On 23/02/2016 09:32, Alycidon wrote:
On Tuesday, 23 February 2016 09:17:07 UTC, Nick wrote:
On 23/02/2016 08:40, Alycidon wrote:
QUOTE:

"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution
more effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing
their own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling
and 'not choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...l-legacy-dash-

diesel-Air-pollution-killing-40-000-year-UK.html#comments


But how many people's elbows has pollution jostled whilst riding on
the pavement?

The politicians who promoted diesel in 2001 should be shot. Its not
like it wasn't obvious at the time.


There are idiots out there who imagine that pure CO2 is spewing out of
car tailpipes and there is nothing to worry about as AGW is a myth.

When challenged to state how they can burn Sulphur and Nitrogen and get
pure CO2, they go quiet. I suppose they are too busy converting Lead
into Gold to reply.


AIUI it isn't the sulphur and nitrogen that cause the problem but
particulates.

I'm not giving a radical change argument. Diesel particulate matter
causes more problems than petrol. To imagine Diesel is more
environmentally friendly due to lower CO2 is idiocy.


and also Nitrogen Oxides.
Diesel combusts at such a high temperature (especially in Turbodiesel
engines) that it causes the Nitrogen and Oxygen in the air to combine and
form NOx, which are very poisonous, polluting, are also a greenhouse
gases and help to cause smog.
  #6  
Old February 23rd 16, 11:27 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
TMS320
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Posts: 3,875
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

"Nick" wrote

I'm not giving a radical change argument. Diesel particulate matter causes
more problems than petrol. To imagine Diesel is more environmentally
friendly due to lower CO2 is idiocy.


It's all lumped as tail pipe emission. Politicians, the press and general
public struggle with the idea that different components have different
effects.

Besides, diesel isn't as low in CO2 as imagined - fuel is taxed by volume
when (assuming the duty really is a CO2 tax) it should be taxed by weight.


  #7  
Old February 23rd 16, 11:28 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
TMS320
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Posts: 3,875
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

"Peter Keller" wrote

and also Nitrogen Oxides.
Diesel combusts at such a high temperature (especially in Turbodiesel
engines) that it causes the Nitrogen and Oxygen in the air to combine and
form NOx, which are very poisonous, polluting, are also a greenhouse
gases and help to cause smog.


Ah, but Volkswagen had a cunning plan.


  #8  
Old February 23rd 16, 01:21 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
jnugent
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Posts: 11,574
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On 23/02/2016 09:16, Nick wrote:

On 23/02/2016 08:40, Alycidon wrote:


QUOTE:
"He called on the Government to monitor exposure to air pollution more
effectively and urged the public to consider ways of reducing their
own contribution by using public transport, walking, cycling and 'not
choosing to drive high-polluting vehicles'."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti....html#comments


But how many people's elbows has pollution jostled whilst riding on the
pavement?


The politicians who promoted diesel in 2001 should be shot. Its not like
it wasn't obvious at the time.


What form do you say this 2001 "promotion" took?

When I was younger, diesel was always cheaper than petrol at the pump -
particularly 4-star and later unleaded petrol. The difference was
usually around 2p a gallon (when 4-star petrol was priced at about 33p a
gallon, 1973 and earlier).

Admittedly, in the seventies, Wilson's government applied a 25% VAT rate
to petrol when the rate on diesel was still taxed at the standard rate
(8% at that time). Previously and sensibly, all road fuel had been
zero-rated because around 66% of the pump price was duty. But in any
case, that 25% rate was gone by the end of 1979 and all fuel was charged
VAT at the same rate.

For about the last twenty years, diesel has been dearer than petrol (due
at least in part to the fact that diesel - even low-sulphur diesel - has
had a higher rate of duty applied than unleaded petrol does; and that
also means more VAT on the extra duty. If that's "promotion", it's hard
to see how it works.

Diesel cars only had to be available (at a reasonable price
differential) to sell themselves. Servicing is cheaper, the engine never
wears out at any typical private annual mileage and the vehicle will do
markedly more miles to a gallon than its petrol-driven equivalent. But
in the 1970s, diesel cars were rare on the UK market - essentially only
Mercedes, etc.
  #9  
Old February 23rd 16, 02:11 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
TMS320
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Posts: 3,875
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

"JNugent" wrote in message

For about the last twenty years, diesel has been dearer than petrol (due
at least in part to the fact that diesel - even low-sulphur diesel - has


The base price is higher.

had a higher rate of duty applied than unleaded petrol does; and that also
means more VAT on the extra duty. If that's "promotion", it's hard to see
how it works.


Diesel and petrol have the same tax per litre. Since the specific gravity
of diesel is 10% higher, hence energy content and CO2 production higher by
that amount, it makes a tax discrepancy of about 6p.

On that matter, since the specific gravity at the pumps has a permitted
+/-4% tolerance, paying by volume purchased is fundamentally the wrong
measure, in any case.



  #10  
Old February 23rd 16, 02:29 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
jnugent
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Posts: 11,574
Default Air pollution is 'killing 40,000 a year in the UK'

On 23/02/2016 13:11, TMS320 wrote:

"JNugent" wrote in message


For about the last twenty years, diesel has been dearer than petrol (due
at least in part to the fact that diesel - even low-sulphur diesel - has


The base price is higher.


There's no good reason for that. It was always a bit cheaper until the
prices went crazy in the 1970s.

had a higher rate of duty applied than unleaded petrol does; and that also
means more VAT on the extra duty. If that's "promotion", it's hard to see
how it works.


Diesel and petrol have the same tax per litre. Since the specific gravity
of diesel is 10% higher, hence energy content and CO2 production higher by
that amount, it makes a tax discrepancy of about 6p.


Well, that's odd, because currently - and I admit I don't know the
reasons for it - many filling station are posting lower prices for
diesel than for petrol. Not much in it, mind. Probably only 1p 0r 1.5p a
litre.

But every little helps, as some of the sellers say.

On that matter, since the specific gravity at the pumps has a permitted
+/-4% tolerance, paying by volume purchased is fundamentally the wrong
measure, in any case.


In your opinion, you mean.
 




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