Does anyone know good thorn-resistant tubes?

Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Thu, 30 Apr 2020 15:03:26 -0700, Joerg wrote:

Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

IMO/E, the manufactuere swapped tube material sometime in the 80s. I use
the car thermal patches to patch mine and suddenly they had trouble
taking the patch. A comparison of old and new tubes confirmed such a
suspisca suspiscion. They also split along the seam easily.

Manufactuerers are firmly following Henry fords dictum; "it only need to
last the warranty" GL

On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 3:03:19 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg, you sure must be one hell of a rider in terrible conditions.

Today I had a large cut in my tubeless tire and that was the last straw. It is just too messy to use and fix out on the roads. Back to tubes and clinchers.

On 2020-04-30 21:24, wrote:
On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 3:03:19 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure
suddenly and overnight without being ridden the day before. It
started to split along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever
since they started making them less than the usual 3mm thick
towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all
around? Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am
running 700c 25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there.
Might go to 28mm in back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent
tire blow-outs (sidewall failure).

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg, you sure must be one hell of a rider in terrible conditions.


Not really. I use my bicycles not much differently than my car.
"Pavement ends" is not a reason for me to give up and turn around. On
the contrary:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/23...g?v=1587241131


Today I had a large cut in my tubeless tire and that was the last
straw. It is just too messy to use and fix out on the roads. Back to
tubes and clinchers.


I think that's a wise decision. It you'd add a tire liner that's even
better. Two of us three riders yesterday have liners, one doesn't. Guess
who got a goat's head flat ...

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Saturday, May 2, 2020 at 12:24:40 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2020-04-30 21:24, wrote:
On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 3:03:19 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure
suddenly and overnight without being ridden the day before. It
started to split along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever
since they started making them less than the usual 3mm thick
towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all
around? Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am
running 700c 25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there.
Might go to 28mm in back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent
tire blow-outs (sidewall failure).

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg, you sure must be one hell of a rider in terrible conditions.


Not really. I use my bicycles not much differently than my car.
"Pavement ends" is not a reason for me to give up and turn around. On
the contrary:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/23...g?v=1587241131


Today I had a large cut in my tubeless tire and that was the last
straw. It is just too messy to use and fix out on the roads. Back to
tubes and clinchers.


I think that's a wise decision. It you'd add a tire liner that's even
better. Two of us three riders yesterday have liners, one doesn't. Guess
who got a goat's head flat ...

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I talked to a friend that does a lot of your type of riding and he said that you can buy tubes that have removable presta valves in them and you can shoot Orange or Stan's Racing sealant into them and pretty much end flat tires.

wrote:
On Saturday, May 2, 2020 at 12:24:40 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2020-04-30 21:24, wrote:
On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 3:03:19 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure
suddenly and overnight without being ridden the day before. It
started to split along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever
since they started making them less than the usual 3mm thick
towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all
around? Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am
running 700c 25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there.
Might go to 28mm in back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent
tire blow-outs (sidewall failure).

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg, you sure must be one hell of a rider in terrible conditions.


Not really. I use my bicycles not much differently than my car.
"Pavement ends" is not a reason for me to give up and turn around. On
the contrary:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/23...g?v=1587241131


Today I had a large cut in my tubeless tire and that was the last
straw. It is just too messy to use and fix out on the roads. Back to
tubes and clinchers.


I think that's a wise decision. It you'd add a tire liner that's even
better. Two of us three riders yesterday have liners, one doesn't. Guess
who got a goat's head flat ...

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I talked to a friend that does a lot of your type of riding and he said
that you can buy tubes that have removable presta valves in them and you
can shoot Orange or Stan's Racing sealant into them and pretty much end flat tires.


The sealant in a tube I’ve used a few times over the years, I’ve always
given up since they only seal very small holes, I’ve always found they
puncture quite easily, make a right mess and not seal!

Tubeless you can seal with those kits roadside apparently, with both valves
will clog if one doesn’t clean or take care.

I found that switching to mildly less racy tyres on the gravel bike solved
stopped the bike being a puncture magnet, and feels just as fast/lively
etc.

Roger Merriman

On 2020-05-10 08:39, Roger Merriman wrote:
wrote:
On Saturday, May 2, 2020 at 12:24:40 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2020-04-30 21:24, wrote:
On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 3:03:19 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure
suddenly and overnight without being ridden the day before. It
started to split along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever
since they started making them less than the usual 3mm thick
towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all
around? Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am
running 700c 25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there.
Might go to 28mm in back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent
tire blow-outs (sidewall failure).

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg, you sure must be one hell of a rider in terrible conditions.


Not really. I use my bicycles not much differently than my car.
"Pavement ends" is not a reason for me to give up and turn around. On
the contrary:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/23...g?v=1587241131


Today I had a large cut in my tubeless tire and that was the last
straw. It is just too messy to use and fix out on the roads. Back to
tubes and clinchers.


I think that's a wise decision. It you'd add a tire liner that's even
better. Two of us three riders yesterday have liners, one doesn't. Guess
who got a goat's head flat ...

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I talked to a friend that does a lot of your type of riding and he said
that you can buy tubes that have removable presta valves in them and you
can shoot Orange or Stan's Racing sealant into them and pretty much end flat tires.


The sealant in a tube I’ve used a few times over the years, I’ve always
given up since they only seal very small holes, I’ve always found they
puncture quite easily, make a right mess and not seal!


Yup. I used the slime stuff years ago. One fine day I had slow leaks and
barely got home. Next morning I found a mess in the garage under the
MTB. Same with other riders. No more of that stuff.


Tubeless you can seal with those kits roadside apparently, with both valves
will clog if one doesn’t clean or take care.

I found that switching to mildly less racy tyres on the gravel bike solved
stopped the bike being a puncture magnet, and feels just as fast/lively
etc.


For me it's "thicker is better". To hell with weight-weenie concerns.
Tire surface, tire liner, 3-4mm wall thickness in the tube. That
requires a hell of a goat's head to punch through. On the MTB there is
another tube around the tire liner, gives extra protection and prevents
chafing.

Of course, my dream would be some stuff I could fill the tire with, no
more air. However, that would envirnmentally not be too good.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 4/30/2020 3:03 PM, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

Your problem is not with the tubes, it's with the tires. What you want
is Schwalbe Marathon Plus HS 440 11100766.01 700C x 25. But beware that
the protection layer adds some height to the tire and it may not fit on
all road bicycles with caliper brakes.

sms wrote:
On 4/30/2020 3:03 PM, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

Your problem is not with the tubes, it's with the tires. What you want
is Schwalbe Marathon Plus HS 440 11100766.01 700C x 25. But beware that
the protection layer adds some height to the tire and it may not fit on
all road bicycles with caliper brakes.



I’d tend to agree though as ever others choices is theirs alone and some
folks like to furrow their own path!

This said in terms of vs thorns I’ve not found the plus useful, as though
it is fairly thick 5mm or so it’s also quite soft so if something does
penetrate the tyre it can work it’s way down, though this was with Hawthorn
which is a different shape ie long shard rather than well the Goats head,
which I’d assume would stop it from keeping going?

At which point for the Plain Marathon plus the depth of tread/tyre and
length of the Goats Head thorn is very close!

I’d thought that Marathon Plus Touring which I used for a year or so would
be a better fit, much more tread and very robust tyres, huge service life
as well.

I did switch them out to BigApples as well the ride was appalling! And bar
2x that I’d had Hawthorn after it had been shredded just manage to push
though. Everything else just ie thorns/glass/shards etc just embedded its
self in the tread harmlessly.

And thus far just over a year 4K miles or so barely any wear, I’ve picked
out the odd shard but nothing has made it though.

Roger Merriman

On 5/3/2020 12:03 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
sms wrote:
On 4/30/2020 3:03 PM, Joerg wrote:
Just had a Kenda thorn-resistant tube fail. It lost pressure suddenly
and overnight without being ridden the day before. It started to split
along a factory seam. This seems to happen ever since they started
making them less than the usual 3mm thick towards the rim.

Does anyone know who still makes the real stuff, 3mm thick all around?
Or maybe another good version thorn-resistant tube? I am running 700c
25mm tires with an additional tire liner in there. Might go to 28mm in
back some day.

The only time I ever lost 3mm all-around tubes was upon violent tire
blow-outs (sidewall failure).

Your problem is not with the tubes, it's with the tires. What you want
is Schwalbe Marathon Plus HS 440 11100766.01 700C x 25. But beware that
the protection layer adds some height to the tire and it may not fit on
all road bicycles with caliper brakes.



I’d tend to agree though as ever others choices is theirs alone and some
folks like to furrow their own path!

This said in terms of vs thorns I’ve not found the plus useful, as though
it is fairly thick 5mm or so it’s also quite soft so if something does
penetrate the tyre it can work it’s way down, though this was with Hawthorn
which is a different shape ie long shard rather than well the Goats head,
which I’d assume would stop it from keeping going?

At which point for the Plain Marathon plus the depth of tread/tyre and
length of the Goats Head thorn is very close!

I’d thought that Marathon Plus Touring which I used for a year or so would
be a better fit, much more tread and very robust tyres, huge service life
as well.

I did switch them out to BigApples as well the ride was appalling! And bar
2x that I’d had Hawthorn after it had been shredded just manage to push
though. Everything else just ie thorns/glass/shards etc just embedded its
self in the tread harmlessly.

And thus far just over a year 4K miles or so barely any wear, I’ve picked
out the odd shard but nothing has made it though.

After reading here about the horrors of goat head thorns, I was very
worried before doing some rides or a tour out west. But we never had one
goat head flat.

I know my bicycling life is charmed (um, knock wood; or give thanks to
La Madonna del Ghisallo and St. Christopher).

But I wonder if I was just lucky, or if I was not riding in goat head
areas, or if my lack of flats was due to my tendency to ride away from
the road's edge.

Car tires do sweep roads clean.

--
- Frank Krygowski