Interbike Pics

Bob Schwartz wrote in message ...
Howard Kveck wrote:
In article ,
"Mack Mad" wrote:

Besides the hotties, did anyone see this?

http://www.pbase.com/image/22198701

Anybody got a clue why spokes laceed to the center of the hub would have any
benefit whatsoever?

Here's the story, if you roll down to where it says "Another innovate..."
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech/2003...=eicma/default

After reading the story I still have no clue why spokes laced to the center
of the hub have any benefit whatsoever. The stated benefits are aerodynamics
and power tranfer which seem to me to be total horse****. Adding a 3rd plane
of spokes ought to make the aerodynamics *WORSE*.

And while I am sure there are people here that are much better versed in
where power losses occur on a bicycle, I'm pretty sure that the spokes are
not one of the major sinks. And even if they were, how would center spokes
make any difference? I get nervous when I see the number of spokes drop too
low because that means each one becomes more critical and causes more of a
problem in cases of failure. These wheels have only 6 spokes on the sides.
If someone sticks a pedal in your wheel the likehood of hitting the deck
seems a certainty. A single broken spoke means you are screwed.

I bet Jobst will have a field day with these.

Bob Schwartz



Seems to me that lateral stiffness would be really poor with this
design. But hey, it is neat looking, which means everybody wil want a
pair. That should be enough to justify charging the expense.

"Steve Blankenship" wrote in message ...
"
You're missing the point. As with curvy seatstays, split chainstays and so
many other recent "innovations", the primary advantage of tri-flange wheels
is that they are immediately recognizable in the bunch as the Next Thing,
thus inspiring gadget lust and it's primary symptom, wallet-empting. Forget
that they will by design be heavier and less stiff laterally than a wheel
with an equal number of spokes but without the extra flange; it's all about
jobs (as distinguished from Jobst)... ;-)

SB

PS - a belated thanks to Sabine for posting the pics. Must admit that new
Kestrel Evoke is cool-looking in a Post-Industrial, Transformer sort of way.

You're welcome and I've added many more pics since then
http://www.pbase.com/sdukes/interbike_2003

"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote in message .net...

Dumbass -


ya, I can be dense sometimes.

It was the demureness of my approach that fooled you I suppose.
They needed your Trans Am in the Yakima booth.

Sabine

In article ,
Bob Schwartz wrote:

Howard Kveck wrote:
In article ,

Here's the story, if you roll down to where it says "Another
innovate..."
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech/2003...=eicma/default

After reading the story I still have no clue why spokes laced to the center
of the hub have any benefit whatsoever. The stated benefits are aerodynamics
and power tranfer which seem to me to be total horse****. Adding a 3rd plane
of spokes ought to make the aerodynamics *WORSE*.

And while I am sure there are people here that are much better versed in
where power losses occur on a bicycle, I'm pretty sure that the spokes are
not one of the major sinks. And even if they were, how would center spokes
make any difference? I get nervous when I see the number of spokes drop too
low because that means each one becomes more critical and causes more of a
problem in cases of failure. These wheels have only 6 spokes on the sides.
If someone sticks a pedal in your wheel the likehood of hitting the deck
seems a certainty. A single broken spoke means you are screwed.

I bet Jobst will have a field day with these.

Bob Schwartz


Bob,
I'll venture a couple of guesses on this. Part of the reason the
manufacturers are going with fewer spokes is because the taller rim sections
(made from better material and welded or in one piece carbon fiber) are strong
enough to stay round with fewer spokes, and I imagine that lateral strength is
also improved. (Imagine how stout a wheel with Fiamme Red Labels would be if it
only had 18-20 spokes - yow!) Perhaps their thought in having the tangential
spokes in the middle is that it guarantees that the power is coming off the hub
in the same plane as the rim, rather than at a (slight) angle. Is this something
that could be measureably better? As you say, power loss because of hub wind-up
does not seem to be an issue now.
As for the aero aspect, perhaps they figure that those spokes are going to be
shielded by the rim. I have no references to aero tests of spoked wheels to look
at to see whether air wraps around the rim as it passes by, but it seems logical
that it does. So would having two layers of spokes be better or worse than three
at egg-beatering (I doubt this is a real word, but you probably get the point,
right?) air? At the rim, where the spokes are traveling fastest, they are all
pretty much in the same plane anyway, so it could be a moot point.
I am going to reserve judgement on these wheels until I see some and see them
being used, but I completely agree with your assessment on the dangers of
minimal spoke counts. Lose one of 32 and your wheel gets a bad wobble, but lose
one of 18 and it's probably going to seriously taco.
By the way, the Hjertberg bros are the guys who did Wheelsmith and they know
Jobst B. pretty well, so he may have already crossed paths with these wheels. I
don't go to rbt so I don't know what he has said about the newest flock of
strangely spoked wheels...

--
tanx,
Howard

"We've reached a higher spiritual plane, that is so high I can't explain
We tell jokes to make you laugh, we play sports so we don't get fat..."
The Dictators

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

In article ,
(sabine) wrote:

"Steve Blankenship" wrote in message
...

PS - a belated thanks to Sabine for posting the pics. Must admit that new
Kestrel Evoke is cool-looking in a Post-Industrial, Transformer sort of
way.

You're welcome and I've added many more pics since then
http://www.pbase.com/sdukes/interbike_2003

You got a bunch of good shots, Sabine, so I say "nice work." Your hat stunt
is a good one, btw. It's a good (dare I say it?) gimick that obviously works
pretty damn well.

--
tanx,
Howard

"We've reached a higher spiritual plane, that is so high I can't explain
We tell jokes to make you laugh, we play sports so we don't get fat..."
The Dictators

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

"Howard Kveck" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(sabine) wrote:

"Steve Blankenship" wrote in message
...

PS - a belated thanks to Sabine for posting the pics. Must admit that
new
Kestrel Evoke is cool-looking in a Post-Industrial, Transformer sort of
way.

You're welcome and I've added many more pics since then
http://www.pbase.com/sdukes/interbike_2003

You got a bunch of good shots, Sabine, so I say "nice work." Your hat
stunt
is a good one, btw. It's a good (dare I say it?) gimick that obviously
works
pretty damn well.



Dumbass -

It's ****ing funny, mixing in clubwear, girly poses and cute captions with
the bike-geekitude of Interbike. I applaud.

The Velo Bellas are attractive enough so that it comes off - if there were
Masters' Fatties in there, the hats, poses and quips would be very cheesy.

In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:


Dumbass -

It's ****ing funny, mixing in clubwear, girly poses and cute captions with
the bike-geekitude of Interbike. I applaud.

Lipo-boy,
Yep, they nailed it on the money. The bike-geek multitudes at Interbike fall
all over themselves for attractive women in the first place, but the humorous
way Velo Bella present themselves has to be disarming to most there. Get people
smiling and they can't help but be more open to you.

The Velo Bellas are attractive enough so that it comes off - if there were
Masters' Fatties in there, the hats, poses and quips would be very cheesy.

Cheesy? It'd be laughable. In a "No, I'm not laughing -with- you, I'm
laughing -at- you" kind of way.

--
tanx,
Howard

"We've reached a higher spiritual plane, that is so high I can't explain
We tell jokes to make you laugh, we play sports so we don't get fat..."
The Dictators

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Yeah, good shots Sabine - I especially like the DeFeet tube socks -
they'll go great with my Converse sneaks and cutoff jeans -



--
Check out my bike blog!

http://diabloscott.blogspot.com

www.cyclingforums.com

--------------------------
Posted via cyclingforums.com
http://www.cyclingforums.com

Howard Kveck wrote in message ...
In article ,
(sabine) wrote:


You're welcome and I've added many more pics since then
http://www.pbase.com/sdukes/interbike_2003

You got a bunch of good shots, Sabine, so I say "nice work." Your hat stunt
is a good one, btw. It's a good (dare I say it?) gimick that obviously works
pretty damn well.

--
tanx,
Howard


Honestly, we didn't plan to do this gimmick. We act goofy like this
all the time and just happen to be wearing the hats because we bought
them at a store outside of Harrah's. Of course, when we saw the
reactions and realized the silly potential of pros in pimp hats, we
rolled with it.

Floyd Landis, Bob Roll, Gilberto Simoni, and Phil Liggett stand out as
real sports about the whole thing. They were all hilarious. George
Hincapie did not want to mess up his hair, but he was so charming and
nice to us that we will of course forgive him. Filip Meirhage ran from
us. The next day he saw us and apologized. He said he thought we were
hired promotional chicks. (You'd think the small boobs and tan lines
would make it obviously not) He offered to wear the hat, but we
wouldn't let him.

Sabine

"sabine" wrote in message
He said he thought we were
hired promotional chicks. (You'd think the small boobs and tan lines
would make it obviously not) He offered to wear the hat, but we
wouldn't let him.

Sabine

Small boobs do not detract from hotness*.


*Only if the chick thinks they do.