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Will Lance quit?



 
 
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  #21  
Old July 21st 03, 05:16 AM
Nick Burns
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Default Will Lance quit?


"Isidor Gunsberg" wrote in message
om...
David Ryan wrote in message

...
Isidor Gunsberg wrote:

Unlike Merckx, Armstrong only races flat out on just a few stages.
A time trial is definitely one of them.

He needs to win a stage in the Pyrenees, since otherwise he
faces the prospect of winning the TDF, yet without winning a single
stage.


According to letour.com:

2003 not ranked
o Wore the yellow jersey
o 1 stage victory : Stage 4 : JOINVILLE - SAINT-DIZIER

(the TTT)


Thanks for sharing. I thought that it was rather obvious, and
hence, could be left unwritten, that a win in a Team Time Trial (TTT)
stage does not accrue much glory to the Individual racer. Wins in
Individual Time Trials (ITTs) have the greatest prestige, followed by
wins in the major mountain stages, followed by wins in the more
glamorous of the sprint (flat) stages. The key is that while one's
team can provide assistance (except in the ITTs), a stage win
manifests a significant level of achievement by the rider who must
ultimately make a substantial individual effort.

Of course, it is expected that on newsgroups one will encounter
some nitpicking by the occasional pedant, although I'm not inclined to
stoop to such pedantry myself.

So congratulations: Technically, you are correct.


I actually agree that with regard to the pressure of the GC winner to win a
stage, the TTT does not really satisfy the desire to shoe oneself as the
strongest rider.

I do not agree that an ITT is more important than a mountain stage. They are
probably equally prestigious.


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  #22  
Old July 21st 03, 04:40 PM
warren
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Default Will Lance quit?

In article , Nick Burns
wrote:

"Ewoud Dronkert" wrote in message
fn.de...
On 19 Jul 2003 20:00:12 -0700, Isidor Gunsberg wrote:
Wins in Individual Time Trials (ITTs) have the greatest prestige,
followed by wins in the major mountain stages, followed by wins
in the more glamorous of the sprint (flat) stages.


I disagree. For me, wins with the greatest prestige are those in
mountain stages with mountain top finishes where the winner has the
fastest climb of the day.



Absolutely. I would take it one step further and say that any winner of a
mountain stage that sets a record for the final climb along the way will not
soon be forgotten.


Nah, the wins where there was alot at stake are the most memorable.
Today for example. I could care less what time for the climb was.

-WG
  #23  
Old July 24th 03, 01:10 AM
Isidor Gunsberg
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Default Will Lance quit?

"Nick Burns" wrote in message ...
"Isidor Gunsberg" wrote in message
om...
David Ryan wrote in message

...
Isidor Gunsberg wrote:

Unlike Merckx, Armstrong only races flat out on just a few stages.
A time trial is definitely one of them.

He needs to win a stage in the Pyrenees, since otherwise he
faces the prospect of winning the TDF, yet without winning a single
stage.

According to letour.com:

2003 not ranked
o Wore the yellow jersey
o 1 stage victory : Stage 4 : JOINVILLE - SAINT-DIZIER

(the TTT)


Thanks for sharing. I thought that it was rather obvious, and
hence, could be left unwritten, that a win in a Team Time Trial (TTT)
stage does not accrue much glory to the Individual racer. Wins in
Individual Time Trials (ITTs) have the greatest prestige, followed by
wins in the major mountain stages, followed by wins in the more
glamorous of the sprint (flat) stages. The key is that while one's
team can provide assistance (except in the ITTs), a stage win
manifests a significant level of achievement by the rider who must
ultimately make a substantial individual effort.

Of course, it is expected that on newsgroups one will encounter
some nitpicking by the occasional pedant, although I'm not inclined to
stoop to such pedantry myself.

So congratulations: Technically, you are correct.


I actually agree that with regard to the pressure of the GC winner to win a
stage, the TTT does not really satisfy the desire to shoe oneself as the
strongest rider.

I do not agree that an ITT is more important than a mountain stage. They are
probably equally prestigious.


The reason why I consider an Individual Time Trial stage win to be
more prestigous is that in the ITT, the winning rider and his main
riders are almost always riding for a maximum result--to ride as fast
as possible.

Yet, it is often the case in Mountain stages that one of the top
riders, vying for GC, will not be so concerned about actually winning
the stage. Theor main concern is to take time from their main rivals.
It was just a few years ago that Armstrong basically allowed Pantini
to win the stage at the Mt. Ventoux climb, by not sprinting at the
end. One gets the sense that the "Padroni" (in this case, Armstrong),
might be inclined to dole out a few favors, by letting other riders
take the glory of the stage win. And Mt. Ventoux is one of the major
3-4 "legendary " mountain stages.

Also, as one can see from the Pyrenees stages, a rider like Sastre
or Simoni is allowed to break, because they are not deemed to be a
threat. Their attack is parried. Such a rider, who is not really
competing for a high place, can afford to burn all his energy on the
one stage. Often, he conserves energy in the prior stage by riding in
a trailing grupetto. And the next stage, they finish back in the pack.
So, a rider may win a mountain stage, but yet end up losing 20-30
minutes to the GC leaders, over all three stages.
 




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