Who needs EPO?

In article , DiabloScott
wrote:
Today they would DQ these folks on high
hematocrit levels.

They could get benefit and still be below the allowable limit.

-WG

warren wrote in message ...
In article , DiabloScott
wrote:
Today they would DQ these folks on high
hematocrit levels.

They could get benefit and still be below the allowable limit.

-WG

Or they could be artificially manipulating thier plasma volume as well
as the red cell volume.

Or if the blood was alliquoted in smaller volumes. They'd be better
off taking a little at a time over the course of their peak.

Someone a few months ago posted about how skiiers had "blood mules"
accompany them to the olympics. Rumsas's mother in law might have
been using the drugs after all. I wonder what her blood type is?

On 15 Aug 2003 10:44:26 +0950, DiabloScott
This is pretty much what the US Olympians (including Grewal and Twigg)
did in LA in 1984.

Goes back at least to Lasse Viren the Finnish Olympic 5 and 10,000 mtr
champ from the 1972 Games.

Regards!
Stephen

On Fri, 15 Aug 2003 17:09:35 +0100, Steve McGinty
wrote:

On 15 Aug 2003 10:44:26 +0950, DiabloScott
This is pretty much what the US Olympians (including Grewal and Twigg)
did in LA in 1984.

Goes back at least to Lasse Viren the Finnish Olympic 5 and 10,000 mtr
champ from the 1972 Games.

Every time someone mentions Lasse Viren I think of the old Be Bop
Deluxe song, Modern Music.

"Lasse Viren, 3 Olympic Gold Medals already ..."

That voice sounds a lot like Phil Liggett.

Lindsay
----------------------------
"One of the annoying things about believing in free
will and individual responsibility is the difficulty
of finding somebody to blame your problems on. And
when you do find somebody, it's remarkable how often
his picture turns up on your driver's license."

P.J. O'Rourke

"warren" wrote in message
...
In article , DiabloScott
wrote:
Today they would DQ these folks on high
hematocrit levels.

They could get benefit and still be below the allowable limit.

Err, what is the benefit of having the same level as everyone else?

"Kolaga Xiuhtecuhtli" wrote in message
...

So I can't figure how anyone can exceed the normal limits
unless they live in Peru or else they smoke heavily.

Because 'sports anemia' is not seen in cyclists - it is seen in runners and
other athletes that runs. so perhaps you are just at the low end of the
scale (like me...)

- Mikkel
--
Mikkel Gybel Jensen
http://home.tiscali.dk/~mgj
http://www.pcarlp.dk
http://www.rumfart.dk

In article et, Tom
Kunich wrote:

"warren" wrote in message
...
In article , DiabloScott
wrote:
Today they would DQ these folks on high
hematocrit levels.

They could get benefit and still be below the allowable limit.

Err, what is the benefit of having the same level as everyone else?

Many are "naturally" well below the limit, say, 38-44, and they could
"artificially" increase their hematocrit up as far as possible to 45-48
and stay under the limit.

-WG

"Mikkel Gybel Jensen" wrote in message
k...
"Kolaga Xiuhtecuhtli" wrote in message
...

So I can't figure how anyone can exceed the normal limits
unless they live in Peru or else they smoke heavily.

Because 'sports anemia' is not seen in cyclists

Says who? So-called footstrike hemolysis obviously doesn't occur in (road)
cyclists, but there is still an increase in plasma volume that results in a
decline in hematocrit and hence a pseudo-anemia.

Andy Coggan

You bring up an interesting point: why has blood doping fallen out of
fashion? Or has it?

-Dion

"warren" wrote in message
...
Here's an interesting web page about blood doping/boosting.

http://www.gen.umn.edu/faculty_staff...tudent_project
s/Sum2000/Blood_doping/dopehow.htm


"Approximately six weeks before competition an athlete withdraws one to
four units of his/her blood (1 unit = 450 ml of blood). The blood is
centrifuged and the athlete then immediately reinfuses the plasma
components. The remaining red blood cells are placed in cold storage.
The six week time frame is important since this is how long it takes an
individual to restore the lost blood. Between 1 to 7 days before the
event, the athlete reinfuses the red blood cells placed in storage.
When this process is performed accurately, an athlete can increase
his/her hemoglobin level and red blood cell count by up to 20%. This
provides the body with an increased oxygen level to greater improve
athletic performance and increase the body's potential.

The effects of blood doping are boosted when the athlete trains at a
high altitude. At high altitudes, the athlete's body, which is used to
an hypoxic state, will compensate by increasing red blood cell
production. When the athlete moves down to a low altitude, their body
is engulfed with oxygen rich red blood cells, helping their
performance. The athlete then further boosts their body's oxygen level
by infusing the stored red blood cells."


The site provides an example (doesn't state if high-alttude training
was also utilized) and shows that Hematocrit increased from 43 to 55,
and VO2max increased by 13%.

In article , Dion Dock
wrote:

You bring up an interesting point: why has blood doping fallen out of
fashion? Or has it?

That's my question. Why wouldn't people still be doing it?

-WG

-Dion

"warren" wrote in message
...
Here's an interesting web page about blood doping/boosting.

http://www.gen.umn.edu/faculty_staff...tudent_project
s/Sum2000/Blood_doping/dopehow.htm


"Approximately six weeks before competition an athlete withdraws one to
four units of his/her blood (1 unit = 450 ml of blood). The blood is
centrifuged and the athlete then immediately reinfuses the plasma
components. The remaining red blood cells are placed in cold storage.
The six week time frame is important since this is how long it takes an
individual to restore the lost blood. Between 1 to 7 days before the
event, the athlete reinfuses the red blood cells placed in storage.
When this process is performed accurately, an athlete can increase
his/her hemoglobin level and red blood cell count by up to 20%. This
provides the body with an increased oxygen level to greater improve
athletic performance and increase the body's potential.

The effects of blood doping are boosted when the athlete trains at a
high altitude. At high altitudes, the athlete's body, which is used to
an hypoxic state, will compensate by increasing red blood cell
production. When the athlete moves down to a low altitude, their body
is engulfed with oxygen rich red blood cells, helping their
performance. The athlete then further boosts their body's oxygen level
by infusing the stored red blood cells."


The site provides an example (doesn't state if high-alttude training
was also utilized) and shows that Hematocrit increased from 43 to 55,
and VO2max increased by 13%.