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#51
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tuesday, July 31, 2018 at 11:29:39 AM UTC-4, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 08:14:56 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 11:37:14 +0700, John B. Slocomb wrote: I see bare plastic seats offered for sale here, and I do see them on bikes so I'm not sure that the hardness of the seat surface is germane to the problem. My Velo saddle for instance appears to have no padding, or very little of it. Just the seat core with a layer of vinyl over it. If a hard thin saddle works, then it would be easy enough to vacuum form a bicycle saddle. Almost any thermoplastic plastic can be used. I guess ABS and acrylic would be the cheapest. Just make a butt mold, drill full of holes for the vacuum lines, apply plastic sheet, heat until soft, suck the plastic over the butt mold with a vacuum, trim off the excess, deburr, and add a metal frame. Adding a vinyl cover would reduce surface friction and make it easier to include advertising content. If you have access to a tracer mill: https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/attachments/f20/17699d1260010155-2-headed-tracer-mill-005.jpg you can duplicate your favorite saddle in aluminum, plastic, fiberglass, etc. Add hardware and you have a potential candidate for a hard bicycle saddle. My assumption is that IS how a great many bicycle seats, whether padded or not, are manufactured. I doubt vacuum forming is used to form the base. Probably injection molding. - Frank Krygowski |
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#52
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tuesday, July 31, 2018 at 8:14:58 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 11:37:14 +0700, John B. Slocomb wrote: I see bare plastic seats offered for sale here, and I do see them on bikes so I'm not sure that the hardness of the seat surface is germane to the problem. My Velo saddle for instance appears to have no padding, or very little of it. Just the seat core with a layer of vinyl over it. If a hard thin saddle works, then it would be easy enough to vacuum form a bicycle saddle. Almost any thermoplastic plastic can be used. I guess ABS and acrylic would be the cheapest. Just make a butt mold, drill full of holes for the vacuum lines, apply plastic sheet, heat until soft, suck the plastic over the butt mold with a vacuum, trim off the excess, deburr, and add a metal frame. Adding a vinyl cover would reduce surface friction and make it easier to include advertising content. If you have access to a tracer mill: https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/attachments/f20/17699d1260010155-2-headed-tracer-mill-005.jpg you can duplicate your favorite saddle in aluminum, plastic, fiberglass, etc. Add hardware and you have a potential candidate for a hard bicycle saddle. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 https://www.amazon.com/QILEFU-Mounta...on+fiber&psc=1 They've been making molded saddles for a long time. Prologo makes comfortable saddles. You treat saddle sores by not getting them. This means that you have clean bicycle shorts to start with and remove them IMMEDIATELY from getting back from a ride. Saddle sores are caused in general not by a hard saddle but by a mis-fitting saddle that can cause abrasions on the crotch. These are generally not serious but sitting around in these shorts after the ride allows the damp pad to grow a mold on the skin which is what causes the infection. I treat a saddle sore with Neosporin. |
#53
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Saddle sore solutions?
John B. Slocomb wrote:
Yes, I've done them as well. And that's when you start to think more about your gear. This isn't to say that the inventory saddles still shouldn't do for most people, of course. Why ever so? "Bottom" line, I don't think people have that different bodies. It is part of being normal which by definition most people are. -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#54
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:27:32 +0200, Emanuel Berg
wrote: John B. Slocomb wrote: Yes, I've done them as well. And that's when you start to think more about your gear. This isn't to say that the inventory saddles still shouldn't do for most people, of course. Why ever so? "Bottom" line, I don't think people have that different bodies. It is part of being normal which by definition most people are. You mean that everyone wears the same size shoes? That everyone's pant legs are the same length or that everyone's waist measurement is the same? It might be commented that the tallest individual was/is eight feet, 11 inches, tall and the shortest recorded was 21.5 inches that is a difference of about 85 inches. -- Cheers, John B. |
#55
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:29:35 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote: My assumption is that IS how a great many bicycle seats, whether padded or not, are manufactured. http://www.madehow.com/Volume-7/Bicycle-Seat.html That above article says that the shell is injection molded: The hard plastic shell forms the foundation of the bicycle seat. The contour of the saddle is rendered in a metal mold... Whatever their configuration, these seats are injection molded. Vacuum forming has it's place, but you're making many such saddles, injection molded plastic parts the much cheaper and faster to produce. Note that the larger part of the secret is to make the seats in China :-) Yeah, I noticed. It costs less to make a finished product in China than it does to buy the parts and components in the US. Grumble. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#56
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Saddle sore solutions?
On 7/30/2018 11:20 PM, Doc O'Leary wrote:
The point isn’t to get anyone to stand for their entire ride. I can’t even pretend I’d be able to do that. The point is to just get them to think about *everything* that could be making bike riding less fun than it could be. It might make a world of difference to go from putting 100% of your weight on your butt to 90% or 80% or whatever. Or, really, just exercising the *option* to stand from time to time. Too many people seem to think they’re just supposed to park their ass in the seat and then put in the minimal amount of effort needed to make the pedals go around. That’s certainly *a* way to ride a bike, but it is unquestionably going to be a different experience from those who are really pushing the bike to make it go faster. Regarding standing from time to time: Back in the 1970s when I was just beginning to ride avidly, I had lots of trouble getting comfortable on the saddle. One friend who worked in a bike shop said "You need to post." I asked "What's that?" and he replied "Stand up from time to time, like a jockey does on a horse." I've never heard the word "post" used that way, but I began doing it from time to time, and it definitely helps. My wife has been having a little saddle discomfort on our tandem. After a couple hours in the saddle, she asks if she can stand on some downhills. It seems to help her. -- - Frank Krygowski |
#57
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:41:15 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote: On 7/30/2018 11:20 PM, Doc O'Leary wrote: The point isn’t to get anyone to stand for their entire ride. I can’t even pretend I’d be able to do that. The point is to just get them to think about *everything* that could be making bike riding less fun than it could be. It might make a world of difference to go from putting 100% of your weight on your butt to 90% or 80% or whatever. Or, really, just exercising the *option* to stand from time to time. Too many people seem to think they’re just supposed to park their ass in the seat and then put in the minimal amount of effort needed to make the pedals go around. That’s certainly *a* way to ride a bike, but it is unquestionably going to be a different experience from those who are really pushing the bike to make it go faster. Regarding standing from time to time: Back in the 1970s when I was just beginning to ride avidly, I had lots of trouble getting comfortable on the saddle. One friend who worked in a bike shop said "You need to post." I asked "What's that?" and he replied "Stand up from time to time, like a jockey does on a horse." I've never heard the word "post" used that way, but I began doing it from time to time, and it definitely helps. My wife has been having a little saddle discomfort on our tandem. After a couple hours in the saddle, she asks if she can stand on some downhills. It seems to help her. Post isn't just standing from time to time, it is standing about half the time. When a horse trots it is a very short pace and at a much quicker interval then any other gate so what one does is (sort of) stand up on (say) the odd step and sits down on the even. Which smooth's things out considerably. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thpmgolDsbQ A jockey, on the other hand rides in a semi standing position for the entire race which allows him to better position his weight to help the horse run. .. -- Cheers, John B. |
#58
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 17:55:53 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote: On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:29:35 +0700, John B. Slocomb wrote: My assumption is that IS how a great many bicycle seats, whether padded or not, are manufactured. http://www.madehow.com/Volume-7/Bicycle-Seat.html That above article says that the shell is injection molded: The hard plastic shell forms the foundation of the bicycle seat. The contour of the saddle is rendered in a metal mold... Whatever their configuration, these seats are injection molded. Vacuum forming has it's place, but you're making many such saddles, injection molded plastic parts the much cheaper and faster to produce. Note that the larger part of the secret is to make the seats in China :-) Yeah, I noticed. It costs less to make a finished product in China than it does to buy the parts and components in the US. Grumble. Well, if wou are willing to accept a demestic economy similar to China's you can do it too :-) Here, for example, the minimum salary (nationally) is 300 baht, $9.01, per day which is paid mostly to day labour. -- Cheers, John B. |
#59
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Saddle sore solutions?
On Mon, 30 Jul 2018 19:04:39 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote: On Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:47:45 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie wrote: The future is here. https://www.sq-lab.com/en/sqlab-ergonomics/sqlab-concepts/sqlab-the-way-to-the-perfect-saddle.html Bah Humbug. Too complexicated. All that is needed is to first digitize the riders butt, clean up the lumps and bumps on a computah, and make a plaster or urethane foam casting. The saddle is then molded from the casting or machined from the digitized data, providing a perfect fit that distributes the riders weight evenly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kwmif4HbhfE Admittedly, it would look a bit strange, but the perfect saddle fit would make the inevitable ridicule from other riders worth tolerating. Once the perfect saddle has been built and tested, it's easy enough to make additional identical saddles. If that's not good enough, how about a bicycle "water saddle"? I used to have a water bed until the cost of electricity and my worthless cat stretching his claws, conspired to make it uneconomical and leaky. I suspect a "water saddle" would be just as comfortable. It could also double as a water bottle in an emergency. If that's not good enough, perhaps a toilet seat (inspired) bicycle saddle? http://www.heraldtribune.com/news/20051011/toilet-seat-inspires-bicyclists-big-idea https://www.ismseat.com Ever tried pedaling a toilet seat? |
#60
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Saddle sore solutions?
On 7/31/2018 11:39 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:41:15 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 7/30/2018 11:20 PM, Doc O'Leary wrote: The point isn’t to get anyone to stand for their entire ride. I can’t even pretend I’d be able to do that. The point is to just get them to think about *everything* that could be making bike riding less fun than it could be. It might make a world of difference to go from putting 100% of your weight on your butt to 90% or 80% or whatever. Or, really, just exercising the *option* to stand from time to time. Too many people seem to think they’re just supposed to park their ass in the seat and then put in the minimal amount of effort needed to make the pedals go around. That’s certainly *a* way to ride a bike, but it is unquestionably going to be a different experience from those who are really pushing the bike to make it go faster. Regarding standing from time to time: Back in the 1970s when I was just beginning to ride avidly, I had lots of trouble getting comfortable on the saddle. One friend who worked in a bike shop said "You need to post." I asked "What's that?" and he replied "Stand up from time to time, like a jockey does on a horse." I've never heard the word "post" used that way, but I began doing it from time to time, and it definitely helps. My wife has been having a little saddle discomfort on our tandem. After a couple hours in the saddle, she asks if she can stand on some downhills. It seems to help her. Post isn't just standing from time to time, it is standing about half the time. When a horse trots it is a very short pace and at a much quicker interval then any other gate so what one does is (sort of) stand up on (say) the odd step and sits down on the even. Which smooth's things out considerably. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thpmgolDsbQ Ah, I learned something. Thanks! -- - Frank Krygowski |
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