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  #11  
Old May 31st 09, 11:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Johnny Twelve-Point presented by JFT
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Default Slayin' it

On Sun, 31 May 2009 15:07:52 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

On May 31, 5:53*pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message

This is just nuts. *First, wins Jr World TT. *Follows it up with World
Cup pursuit wins, a ride in the Olympics, AND World Championship
pursuit title. *National pursuit and kilo titles. *Now he goes and
pulls off the U23 Paris Roubaix win. *What's next for Mini Phinney? *I
mean, he's only 18!! *When he figures out what he's really best at,
it's gonna be amazing.


Not really. Let's remember that in his age category he isn't meeting the
best possible racers. So a good racer looks like a spectacular racer.


Hey can anyone translate that for me? I don't speak idiot


You understand it better than you think. TK simply wrote: "I'm an
idiot."
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  #12  
Old May 31st 09, 11:42 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Scott
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On May 31, 4:26*pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message

...

On May 31, 3:53 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:


Not really. Let's remember that in his age category he isn't meeting the
best possible racers. So a good racer looks like a spectacular racer.


Are you suggesting for a moment that the competitors at the various
track world cups or track world championships or perhaps the Olympics,
weren't the best possible racers??? *The only race I mentioned that
was "age-graded" was the Espoirs Paris Roubaix, and it's damn sure not
like he's racing against a bunch of slouches three or four years his
junior. *He's in his first year in the "espoirs" and he's doing pretty
damn well against some of the top competitors four to five years his
senior. *Besides, look at the list of previous winners and tell us
sincerely that winning that race doesn't mean something.


Who was the last great track star that really shown in road racing?


Pay attention, Tom, I'm typing slowly so you can keep up. He's
EIGHTEEN. He's not a great track star, he's a budding pro cyclist
who's yet to determine exactly what he's best at. The fact that he
started winning pursuits within just a few months of his first ever
ride on a velodrome does not mean he's a trackie, it means he's one
gifted SOB and he's got many years to show all the different things he
can/will do. Winning the U23 Paris Roubaix at the age of EIGHTEEN is
further evidence that he's not a trackie.

As for your dumbass statement, let's see... practically any pro who
came up through the Soviet or East German or Australian or British jr
racing systems. They all focus on track racing and have turned out
some pretty good riders. The list includes, but is not limited to
Ekimov, O'Grady, Wiggins, Zabel, Cavendish, Boardman, etc, etc,
frikkin etc... Oh, Merckx was a pretty good trackie in his day, as I
recall.

  #13  
Old May 31st 09, 11:46 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Scott
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On May 31, 4:33*pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message

...

On May 31, 3:53 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:


Not really. Let's remember that in his age category he isn't meeting the
best possible racers. So a good racer looks like a spectacular racer.


Are you suggesting for a moment that the competitors at the various
track world cups or track world championships or perhaps the Olympics,
weren't the best possible racers??? *The only race I mentioned that
was "age-graded" was the Espoirs Paris Roubaix, and it's damn sure not
like he's racing against a bunch of slouches three or four years his
junior. *He's in his first year in the "espoirs" and he's doing pretty
damn well against some of the top competitors four to five years his
senior. *Besides, look at the list of previous winners and tell us
sincerely that winning that race doesn't mean something.


And by the way, I wasn't saying that he isn't a good rider or won't be a
great rider. I was saying that you can't predict yet what he will become
because the level of competition he's been up against is NOT world class.
All the world class guys went straight to the pros. Or haven't you noticed
guys like Contador were hired by high end professional teams at 22?


What part of "he's 18" don't you get? How the hell does Contador
going into the pros at 22 have a damn thing to do with this? And,
don't go weasling out of your stupid ass comment by saying you were
just saying we can't predict what he'll do or become. That was the
point to my post, which you chose to respond to in typical dumbass
fashion. If you'd meant to say that, you'd have said that. But, no,
you chose to diminish the importance of his win(s) in your typical
dumbassardly fashion by claiming he wasn't racing against good racers.
  #14  
Old May 31st 09, 11:55 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Tom Kunich
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Default Slayin' it

"Scott" wrote in message
...
On May 31, 4:33 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

And by the way, I wasn't saying that he isn't a good rider or won't be a
great rider. I was saying that you can't predict yet what he will become
because the level of competition he's been up against is NOT world
class.
All the world class guys went straight to the pros. Or haven't you
noticed
guys like Contador were hired by high end professional teams at 22?


What part of "he's 18" don't you get? How the hell does Contador
going into the pros at 22 have a damn thing to do with this?


If you don't understand any of this there's no need to try to explain it to
you.

And, don't go weasling out of your stupid ass comment by saying you
were just saying we can't predict what he'll do or become.


Then you want to place a bet that a 6'4" tall guy is going to be a world
class climbing champion and Tour winner?


  #15  
Old June 1st 09, 12:01 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
--D-y
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Posts: 1,179
Default Slayin' it

On May 31, 5:26*pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

Who was the last great track star that really shown in road racing?


TK, you just used a HOMOphone! (he shown instead of shone)

Just sayin'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1u4CXlIYjyE

====================================

Cavendish, a not a "great track star", although with some palmares,
who has certainly shown, so to speak, in road racing.
--D-y



  #16  
Old June 1st 09, 12:06 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
RicodJour
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Posts: 3,142
Default Slayin' it

On May 31, 6:55*pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

And, don't go weasling out of your stupid ass comment by saying you
were just saying we can't predict what he'll do or become.


Then you want to place a bet that a 6'4" tall guy is going to be a world
class climbing champion and Tour winner?


Scott wrote, "What's next for Mini Phinney? I mean, he's only 18!!
When he figures out what he's really best at, it's gonna be amazing."

Yep, no doubt about it - Scott _definitely_ said that the kid would be
a multi-Tour winner. You're such a maroon. Stop putting words in
other people's mouths when you have such trouble with the ones coming
out of your own.

Either put the bottle or the keyboard down, preferably both. Take a
nap. Bathe. Take a fresh run at it tomorrow.

R
  #17  
Old June 1st 09, 12:16 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Carl Sundquist[_3_]
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Default Slayin' it

Tom Kunich wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message
...
On May 31, 3:53 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

Not really. Let's remember that in his age category he isn't meeting

the
best possible racers. So a good racer looks like a spectacular racer.


Are you suggesting for a moment that the competitors at the various
track world cups or track world championships or perhaps the Olympics,
weren't the best possible racers??? The only race I mentioned that
was "age-graded" was the Espoirs Paris Roubaix, and it's damn sure not
like he's racing against a bunch of slouches three or four years his
junior. He's in his first year in the "espoirs" and he's doing pretty
damn well against some of the top competitors four to five years his
senior. Besides, look at the list of previous winners and tell us
sincerely that winning that race doesn't mean something.


Who was the last great track star that really shown in road racing?


Wiggins does fairly well. So have Roulston, McGee and some guy named
O'Grady. If you're German you can include Zabel.
  #18  
Old June 1st 09, 12:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Carl Sundquist[_3_]
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Posts: 222
Default Slayin' it

Howard Kveck wrote:
In article ,
Scott wrote:

On May 31, 3:53 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message

...

This is just nuts. First, wins Jr World TT. Follows it up with World
Cup pursuit wins, a ride in the Olympics, AND World Championship
pursuit title. National pursuit and kilo titles. Now he goes and
pulls off the U23 Paris Roubaix win. What's next for Mini Phinney? I
mean, he's only 18!! When he figures out what he's really best at,
it's gonna be amazing.
Not really. Let's remember that in his age category he isn't meeting the
best possible racers. So a good racer looks like a spectacular racer.

As Bubba's Momma would say, "boy, is you stupid?"

Are you suggesting for a moment that the competitors at the various
track world cups or track world championships or perhaps the Olympics,
weren't the best possible racers??? The only race I mentioned that
was "age-graded" was the Espoirs Paris Roubaix, and it's damn sure not
like he's racing against a bunch of slouches three or four years his
junior. He's in his first year in the "espoirs" and he's doing pretty
damn well against some of the top competitors four to five years his
senior. Besides, look at the list of previous winners and tell us
sincerely that winning that race doesn't mean something.

Geez, Tom, you must really be looking to start an argument or you are
clinically frikkin stupid to make that comment.


Does it have to be one or the other? Anyway, I think you're right about Phinney -
he does seem to have a lot of power. The more different kinds of races he gets to do,
the more he'll learn about what he's really good at and focus on those. But I'll also
bet that he'll work at improving the things he wasn't as good at. I think Carl's
correct about his racecraft but that comes with time and riding against good
competitors.


Considering that his engine may have compensated, he may have to unlearn
some habits.
  #19  
Old June 1st 09, 12:59 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Carl Sundquist[_3_]
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Posts: 222
Default Slayin' it

Tom Kunich wrote:
"Scott" wrote in message
...
On May 31, 4:33 pm, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

And by the way, I wasn't saying that he isn't a good rider or won't

be a
great rider. I was saying that you can't predict yet what he will

become
because the level of competition he's been up against is NOT world

class.
All the world class guys went straight to the pros. Or haven't you

noticed
guys like Contador were hired by high end professional teams at 22?


What part of "he's 18" don't you get? How the hell does Contador
going into the pros at 22 have a damn thing to do with this?


If you don't understand any of this there's no need to try to explain it
to you.

And, don't go weasling out of your stupid ass comment by saying you
were just saying we can't predict what he'll do or become.


Then you want to place a bet that a 6'4" tall guy is going to be a world
class climbing champion and Tour winner?


Indurain was/is 6'2", 172 lbs.

Axel Merckx is 6' 3 1/2", racing weight of 169.

Alexi Grewal was 6'2, 150 lbs.

The Trek/Livestrong website has Phinney as 6'4", (and it surprised me)
180 lbs.

I'll bet he can lean out some if need be.

Besides, what if he becomes just a totally badass classics rider like
Bettini? Does that deem him a failure?
  #20  
Old June 1st 09, 01:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
[email protected]
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Default Slayin' it

On May 31, 7:59*pm, Carl Sundquist wrote:
Tom Kunich wrote:
Then you want to place a bet that a 6'4" tall guy is going to be a world
class climbing champion and Tour winner?


Indurain was/is 6'2", 172 lbs.

Axel Merckx is 6' 3 1/2", racing weight of 169.

Alexi Grewal was 6'2, 150 lbs.

The Trek/Livestrong website has Phinney as 6'4", *(and it surprised me)
180 lbs.

I'll bet he can lean out some if need be.

Besides, what if he becomes just a totally badass classics rider like
Bettini? Does that deem him a failure?


Speaking of classics riders, Wiki lists Tom Boonen at exactly 6'4",
180#.
 




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