I'm ashamed to admit I was conned.

On Dec 30, 6:07*am, Cicero Venatio wrote:
Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. *I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. *All of it went into the dumpster. *The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. *It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. *But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. *That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. *He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.

It was all such a waste of time. *Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. *Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

I wish I could discover the real joy of riding, but I think I would
have to move to San Diego to do it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
-- Jay Beattie.

On Dec 30, 9:07*am, Cicero Venatio wrote:
Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. *I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. *All of it went into the dumpster. *The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. *It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. *But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. *That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. *He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.


it was so obvious THEN even- I couldn't imagine all the fools here who
believed
( and they STILL believe the ****er )

It was a such a waste of time. *Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. *Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"

On Dec 30, 12:17*pm, raamman wrote:

It was a such a waste of time. *Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. *Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"

I'm well under 200 and my touring bike has 47s, while the SS is set up
for cross with 37s. The 47s at 20psi have been wonderful in this
winter slop, when you don't know if the slush is hiding debris. In
fact, I ran over a concrete parking bumper that was hidden the other
day. Threw my wheel half a mm out of true, but I didn't pinch flat.

It's winter, going fast just dries your skin out and makes your nose
run.

but urine excellent physical condition right ?
complete with a carbo overload

landotter wrote:

I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.

Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. Sort of like a logger
boot with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look
cleat.

That would be racy, yet practical. Wait... I guess "racy" really
means _impractical_, doesn't it? I mean, that's all that so-called
race equipment really has in common, right?

Chalo

?
"Duane Hebert" wrote in message
...

"landotter" wrote in message
...
On Dec 30, 8:07 am, Cicero Venatio wrote:

That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.

Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
deal is about road shoes.

I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
Shimano MTB shoes
that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
side and grips on the other.

I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
used
Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.

They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I
don't
see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
notice
that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.

I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes.
The cleats
are recessed into the sole.

Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.

I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
get
across the intersection.

The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are $150 bucks.

I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.

What's the argument against this setup on a road bike?


I forgot people actually use "road shoes" and tend to think of my Sidi
Dominator as such. They're good when the weather is cold and I can walk in
them. Shoes are hot in warm weather and Keen sandals are far more
comfortable. I never wore shoes again in warm weather after once trying
these.
True road shoes are good for racing I suppose?

On Dec 30, 6:07*am, Cicero Venatio wrote:
Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. *I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. *All of it went into the dumpster. *The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. *It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. *But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. *That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. *He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.

It was all such a waste of time. *Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. *Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

..
..
..
Okay all you retards need to quit your mamby pamby whining and get
over it. It is what it is. Accept it. Lance Armstrong is a doper
just like the rest of your VHS lovers except he is now a saint because
he cures cancer. He's no different than Bernard Madoff because, just
like Bernie, Lance Dopestrong has built his little one nut wonder
empire on lies. In a few weeks you'll all have erections watching him
leave the scene. So take Lance Armstrong and your fat tire, pedal,
and shoe thread and shove it up your ass. You're used to it. For you
it will be like throwing a hot dog down a hallway.
..
..
..

On Dec 30, 1:28*pm, Chalo wrote:
landotter wrote:

I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.

Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. *Sort of like a logger
boot with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look
cleat.

Sounds good to me. Winter mukluks with a Look system. Mink trim to
help prevent "dirty air".


That would be racy, yet practical. *Wait... I guess "racy" really
means _impractical_, doesn't it? *I mean, that's all that so-called
race equipment really has in common, right?

I dunno, take away ceramic bearings, low spoke count wheels, narrow
tires, and a ridiculous bar-seat relationship, you can build a pretty
durable bike out of race kit. Why one would want to throw out that
amount of dosh when $50 Deore shifters are more durable and shift
well, that part's lost on me.

raamman wrote:

Cicero Venatio wrote:

It was a such a waste of time. *Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. *Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"

You are full of gas (and you're a prick, but I guess that's just a
racer thing). A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
contact patch. It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
resistance.

I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
at my shop. Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
compare with those. But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
measure.

Chalo

On Dec 30, 10:23*am, "Duane Hebert" wrote:

Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
deal is about road shoes.

Just some trash talk. Trying to **** on someone else's parade.

I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) *I have a pair of
Shimano MTB shoes
that I use with both bikes. *My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
side and grips on the other.

I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. *I've
used
Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.

Might just be a "fashion" thing. Spuds don't have a reputation for
being the most secure pedals (I'm just reporting here), especially
with the less-secure SH 55 cleats, compared to the "single release"
SH51's. Roadies tend to be jealous of their own safety; unintended
releases can cause nasty crashes.

They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
see that. *They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
notice
that either. *Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.

"Works for you"?

I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. *The
cleats
are recessed into the sole.

No doubt a "MTB" shoe might be more walkable but I've heard/seen of
soles cracking.
There used be a Shimano sandal that was favored by lots of riders. I
saw them used; not my cup of tea but they worked great for those who
favored them.

Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. *I can unclip
and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.

Spuds have been an MTB standard for years, for good reason.

I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
get
across the intersection.

It takes a little practice and learning and I certainly fumbled when I
changed brands a few years ago.

The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are $150 bucks.

Shimano SPD-SL road cleats last much longer than the old Looks I used
to use. and are far safer to walk in at convenience stops.
You use shoes that work for you and if they are cheap(er), so much the
better IMHO.

I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.

Spuds seem to be a Spin standard in my limited experience.

If you didn't have trouble with pulling out of your Looks, especially
if they were the pre-KEO version, I'd guess you won't have trouble
pulling out of the spuds.

FWIW: I've been using Shimano Ultegra PD-6700 pedals (and 6600's) for
several years now and they work great, all the way around including
tension adjustment, secure hold without excessive tension, cleat wear
(excellent IME) and walk-ability. I use Sidi Genius shoes because they
work for me. If they cost less, that would be great...
--D-y