#11
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Off Topic
On 8/1/2019 11:31 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 8:03 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 5:29:18 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? See https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/01/w...nyl-trump.html Fentanyl and all its variants are now controlled substances in China which, of course, does not stop illegal trade. -- Jay Beattie. Oh, is that like China's compliance with pollution treaties? https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/02/w...ghting-it.html China will always talk a great game and sign anything, then ignore any inconvenient agreements. https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-against-china China theorists posit that Hitler annexed Poland and nobody gave a damn. Italy slashed and burned through Ethiopia and the League of Nations wrote resolutions, but zip for action. Therefore... and here we are. Did you notice that after huge Chinese payments to Turkey, Pakistan, the Saudi family and other moslem states, that only the US of A has said _anything_ about 1,000,000+ moslem Uighers in concentration camps in East Turkistan (Western China)? They are not stupid. They know that they can generally get away with anything, but 'generally' being not always. Which is why the huge Chinese anti-Trump media push leading up to 2020. Criminals operating in other nations will satisfy demand in the US. Maybe we should punish China for its lax oversight by inundating them with opium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars -- Jay Beattie Agreed. The Chinese are not stupid. They know that, and seem to be emulating a very successful policy to weaken targeted adversaries. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
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#12
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Off Topic
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers |
#13
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Off Topic
On Fri, 2 Aug 2019 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers If heroin is the main reason that The U.S. and Canada went into Afghanistan then they weren't very successful given that Afghanistan is the single largest producer of Opium and its derivatives in the world :-) -- cheers, John B. |
#14
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Off Topic
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 10:32:44 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 2 Aug 2019 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers If heroin is the main reason that The U.S. and Canada went into Afghanistan then they weren't very successful given that Afghanistan is the single largest producer of Opium and its derivatives in the world :-) -- cheers, John B. What I meant was did those two countries go into Afghanistan to SECURE the opium poppy trade/source? VBEG Cheers |
#15
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Off Topic
On 8/2/2019 9:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 2 Aug 2019 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers If heroin is the main reason that The U.S. and Canada went into Afghanistan then they weren't very successful given that Afghanistan is the single largest producer of Opium and its derivatives in the world :-) -- cheers, John B. I've heard that Afghanistan=opium and Iraq=oil for years despite any rational evidence for either. The same wags used to say Viet Nam=oil too. pfft. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#16
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Off Topic
On 8/2/2019 10:23 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 10:32:44 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Fri, 2 Aug 2019 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers If heroin is the main reason that The U.S. and Canada went into Afghanistan then they weren't very successful given that Afghanistan is the single largest producer of Opium and its derivatives in the world :-) -- cheers, John B. What I meant was did those two countries go into Afghanistan to SECURE the opium poppy trade/source? VBEG Cheers The Soviets, unencumbered by lawyers or reporters, made a brutal effort in Afghanistan with worse results and also brought home an opiate problem. More tar baby than treasure trove IMHO. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#17
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Off Topic
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 11:44:59 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/2/2019 10:23 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 10:32:44 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Fri, 2 Aug 2019 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 8:15:27 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 10:22 PM, John B. wrote: On Thu, 01 Aug 2019 20:23:09 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 7:29 PM, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? -- cheers, John B. Like the situation the past few years in Philippines[1], where legal pharmaceutical stimulants were suddenly and voluminously exceeded by imported methamphetamine from the Norks, Red China and a new domestic industry, the bulk of USA street Fentanyl is not rerouted anaesthetic pharmaceuticals but rather imports from China and China routed through Mexico. This is not news: https://www.news-herald.com/news/ohi...57599081b.html Since the transfer cost of contraband is relatively fixed by mass, imports tend to extremely powerful versions and analogs, notably veterinary Carfentanyl http://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/en/...rfentanil.aspx [1] As with Mr Trump, Mr Duterte has reacted to a real problem, You may disagree with either man's policy or style or rhetoric, but the problems are indeed real. Facts are stubborn things... Frankly while the "solution" may seem to be to get the host country to ban the substance, whatever it may be, in reality that doesn't work. In the recent past Opium was legally sold in Laos. You could go to the market and buy it. Than the U.S. beat the Laotians over the head and got them to outlaw opium and its depravities and while it was no longer sold in the market the production of opium and its depravities actually grew and today it is estimated that Laos and Myanmar (not the major grower of poppies) produced 893 metric tons of opium, in 2013, a 22 percent growth from the previous year. How can this be? Well Europe and the U.S. will buy, albeit illicitly, just about all the opium products that a small country can produce and not surprisingly to any student of economics where a market exists a source will be found to supply it. The current largest producer of poppies in the world is Afghanistan with some 225,000 hectares ( 555,987 acres)in production. What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users. If the demand is reduced then the supply will also be reduced. Is it politically possible in a country like the U.S.? Probably not. -- cheers, John B. "What is the solution? Simple, penalize the users." The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 And thereby making the rich even richer as they deal it. I heroin the MAIN reason the USA and Canada went into Afghanistan? LOL VBRG Cheers If heroin is the main reason that The U.S. and Canada went into Afghanistan then they weren't very successful given that Afghanistan is the single largest producer of Opium and its derivatives in the world :-) -- cheers, John B. What I meant was did those two countries go into Afghanistan to SECURE the opium poppy trade/source? VBEG Cheers The Soviets, unencumbered by lawyers or reporters, made a brutal effort in Afghanistan with worse results and also brought home an opiate problem. More tar baby than treasure trove IMHO. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 "Afghanistan, the Graveyard of Nations". Cheers |
#18
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Off Topic
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 1:15:27 PM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
The net effect of the first hundred years of near-worldwide heroin ban hasn't worked out all that well. Seems to have merely kept the price up, encouraging supply. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 The pure, theoretical, ivory tower solution is to legalise drugs, which instantly kills a lot of crime. I'm surprised that the Left, which also supports fewer people and abortion, hasn't yet twigged that cheap drugs is another eugenic solution to "too many people on Gaia." We'll see how the legalisation of cannabis works out. Andre Jute Not all solutions are equally moral |
#19
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Off Topic
On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 6:03:16 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 5:29:18 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? See https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/01/w...nyl-trump.html Fentanyl and all its variants are now controlled substances in China which, of course, does not stop illegal trade. -- Jay Beattie. Jay, Fentanyl was developed to be used as an injectable painkiller when all else fails. The people in the final stages of cancer and the like do not respond much to most of the pain killers on the market including the strongest forms of Morphine. Of course the drug dealers immediately started manufacturing it in pill form and with which it is extremely easy to misuse. |
#20
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Off Topic
On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 9:31:13 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote: On 8/1/2019 8:03 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 5:29:18 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote: I know this is off topic but I don't find the answer anywhere else. Today's news has Pres. Trump accusing the Chinese of continuing to sell fentanyl to the United States -- "and many Americans continue to die!" But my research shows that fentanyl is a medical drug for the alleviation of severe pain and as such I would assume to be a controlled substance. How than, "many Americans continue to die!" ? See https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/01/w...nyl-trump.html Fentanyl and all its variants are now controlled substances in China which, of course, does not stop illegal trade. -- Jay Beattie. Oh, is that like China's compliance with pollution treaties? https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/02/w...ghting-it.html China will always talk a great game and sign anything, then ignore any inconvenient agreements. https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-against-china China theorists posit that Hitler annexed Poland and nobody gave a damn. Italy slashed and burned through Ethiopia and the League of Nations wrote resolutions, but zip for action. Therefore... and here we are. Did you notice that after huge Chinese payments to Turkey, Pakistan, the Saudi family and other moslem states, that only the US of A has said _anything_ about 1,000,000+ moslem Uighers in concentration camps in East Turkistan (Western China)? They are not stupid. They know that they can generally get away with anything, but 'generally' being not always. Which is why the huge Chinese anti-Trump media push leading up to 2020. Criminals operating in other nations will satisfy demand in the US. Maybe we should punish China for its lax oversight by inundating them with opium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars -- Jay Beattie "We"? Are you a drug dealer? |
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