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#11
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
In article ,
"Tom Grosman" wrote: The reason doping continues to go on despite everyone collectively agreeing that it (or at least the scandals associated with it ) are greatly damaging the sport is because on an indivual level those who dope have no incentive to come clean about past doping activities unless they are caught, and in fact have every incentive not to. Without an incentive to come clean, they also have no incentive to give it up, especially the winners who dope, since it may be or they may feel it is necessary for their success. And as long as a non-trivial percentage of winners dope, doping will continue to be seen as being needed to win, and will be widespread within the peloton. The whole peloton has to reform at once, but each individual has to make that choice for himself. The best and most foolproof way to find people who are doping is is to get them to confess to it. With that in mind, I propose a complete amnesty for all past doping offenses as of Dec 31 2007. You get to keep riding, you get to keep your trophys, you don't get sued by anybody BUT you have to give a complete and detailed confession. If you don't confess and it later comes out that you were doping before Dec 31 2007, you are banned for life from professional racing AND are open to all legal penalties. If you are someone who confessed and you are found to be doping again after Dec 31 2007, you get a stiffer sanction than someone who had never doped (between double penalty and banned for life.) With all the investigations, retroactive testing using newly invented tests, tell-all books, people ratting each other out to save their skins, those that are doping must be living in a continual fear that their number will come up. In addition, I doubt that athletes WANT to dope, but they feel that they HAVE to dope. Giving them a chance to turn the page and to do it as part of the entire peloton, rather than just one person under the press's microscope with only negative rewards for doing so may be the carrot and stick necessary to finally put a significant bite into cycling's doping. What do you get up to when nobody is watching? I offer you amnesty, and I promise not to make fun of you. It's like July. Doping stories bring out the witless mob. -- Michael Press |
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#12
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
On May 7, 12:48 pm, "Tom Grosman" wrote:
The reason doping continues to go on despite everyone collectively agreeing that it (or at least the scandals associated with it ) are greatly damaging the sport is because on an indivual level those who dope have no incentive to come clean about past doping activities unless they are caught, and in fact have every incentive not to. Without an incentive to come clean, they also have no incentive to give it up, especially the winners who dope, since it may be or they may feel it is necessary for their success. And as long as a non-trivial percentage of winners dope, doping will continue to be seen as being needed to win, and will be widespread within the peloton. The whole peloton has to reform at once, but each individual has to make that choice for himself. The best and most foolproof way to find people who are doping is is to get them to confess to it. With that in mind, I propose a complete amnesty for all past doping offenses as of Dec 31 2007. You get to keep riding, you get to keep your trophys, you don't get sued by anybody BUT you have to give a complete and detailed confession. If you don't confess and it later comes out that you were doping before Dec 31 2007, you are banned for life from professional racing AND are open to all legal penalties. If you are someone who confessed and you are found to be doping again after Dec 31 2007, you get a stiffer sanction than someone who had never doped (between double penalty and banned for life.) With all the investigations, retroactive testing using newly invented tests, tell-all books, people ratting each other out to save their skins, those that are doping must be living in a continual fear that their number will come up. In addition, I doubt that athletes WANT to dope, but they feel that they HAVE to dope. Giving them a chance to turn the page and to do it as part of the entire peloton, rather than just one person under the press's microscope with only negative rewards for doing so may be the carrot and stick necessary to finally put a significant bite into cycling's doping. -Tom With that swiftian title, I thought you were going to recommend feeding the offenders to the starving Irish; but the EU inspectors probably would find them unfit for consumption by humans or livestock. |
#13
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
On May 7, 12:48 pm, "Tom Grosman" wrote:
The reason doping continues to go on despite everyone collectively agreeing that it (or at least the scandals associated with it ) are greatly damaging the sport is because on an indivual level those who dope have no incentive to come clean about past doping activities unless they are caught, and in fact have every incentive not to. Without an incentive to come clean, they also have no incentive to give it up, especially the winners who dope, since it may be or they may feel it is necessary for their success. And as long as a non-trivial percentage of winners dope, doping will continue to be seen as being needed to win, and will be widespread within the peloton. The whole peloton has to reform at once, but each individual has to make that choice for himself. Dumbass, The reason doping continues to go on is because on an individual level, the people who benefit from doping are the winning directeur sportifs and team sponsors, and they have no incentive to give it up as long as they don't get caught, and they never get caught because they aren't actually doping. The worst that can happen to the DSes is that their teams fall apart and they lose their jobs, but they can usually get new jobs eventually because lots of people know that that is how the game is played. Increasing the punishment of the riders does nothing. They can always find more riders. Punishing the team sponsors doesn't help much because who would sign on as a sponsor if you could be punished. The problem persists because of the climate of uncertainty (asymmetrical information, no one knows what anyone else is using) and the culture of DSes, coaches, doctors, and hangers-on that support it. Ben |
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
Michael Press wrote:
It's like July. Doping stories bring out the witless mob. If quantities of people being exposed to LIVEDRUNK(tm) advertising is a indicator of rbr success then doping stories are good for rbr. Ergo rbr should sponsor doping. How about Fuentes Gynecology Clinic presented by LIVEDRUNK/RBR or perhaps that isn't catchy enough. |
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
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#17
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
In article ,
Donald Munro wrote: Michael Press wrote: It's like July. Doping stories bring out the witless mob. If quantities of people being exposed to LIVEDRUNK(tm) advertising is a indicator of rbr success then doping stories are good for rbr. Ergo rbr should sponsor doping. How about Fuentes Gynecology Clinic presented by LIVEDRUNK/RBR or perhaps that isn't catchy enough. Yes. I have been going about this all wrong. That is why I am dedicating myself to The Childrens Crusade For Better Chemistry. -- Michael Press |
#18
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
On May 8, 8:32 pm, Michael Press wrote:
Yes. I have been going about this all wrong. That is why I am dedicating myself to The Childrens Crusade For Better Chemistry. -- Michael Press You're going to take up coaching Jr. High football in the south? Bill C |
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
On 8 May 2007 17:39:08 -0700, Bill C wrote:
On May 8, 8:32 pm, Michael Press wrote: Yes. I have been going about this all wrong. That is why I am dedicating myself to The Childrens Crusade For Better Chemistry. -- Michael Press You're going to take up coaching Jr. High football in the south? Ohio. We had guys doing steroids up there back in the early 70s. Ron |
#20
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Dealing with doping- A modest proposal
Basso's "confession" goes to illustrate my point. As long as the penalties
for confessing are much greater than the advantages, it would be absolutely stupid to think Basso would risk his Giro victory, GT podiums, and open himself up to financial and legal liability by admitting to something that can't be proven. Where's the incentive? To help clean up cycling? If he was really concerned about doping in cycling he wouldn't have doped in the first place. BTW, The fact that Basso's idol was Claudio Chiappucci should have been a clue. |
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