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Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk



 
 
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  #11  
Old September 22nd 19, 04:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
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Posts: 1,231
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Saturday, September 21, 2019 at 8:06:14 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 21, 2019 at 6:11:48 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears..

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


If you buy the right Potenza lever, it is hydraulic. I can ride over to Universal and get you a set. https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...iABEgJKRvD_BwE

I don't know why you would want to spend $600 USD on hydraulic levers, though.

== Jay Beattie.


The Hydraulic disk Potenza levers are $128 from Bike Kit Pro so when I get the refund back from Wiggl.com I'll call them up and make sure I am ordering the correct part.

The Potenza levers work like cheap Shimnano levers. You can shift up the cassette 2 or 3 gears at a time but only down one at a time. This might not make a difference with an 11-32 though. Perhaps the ratios are so wide that you don't need to change more than one at a time. I remember that the 8-speeds were like that.
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  #12  
Old September 22nd 19, 04:38 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,231
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears..

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.
  #13  
Old September 22nd 19, 04:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,231
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 5:37:35 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Friday, September 13, 2019 at 1:01:36 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, September 13, 2019 at 9:11:47 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

And why do you want hydro discs? You were claiming they were dangerous
and put you over the bars on your CX bike.


I am sort of upgrading this bike so that my friend who intends to
visit next year will have a bike that fits him.


So, tommy won't ride discs because they're dangerous, but he'll put his friend on a disc-equipped bike he has never ridden.

With friends like tom, you don't need enemies.


On your smartest day you can't even read. I have had several bikes with disk brakes but they are dangerous on CX bikes and hence on road bikes as well since they can lock the wheel up so easily. And the pads wear so rapidly that you have to check them constantly.

My friend is a Cat 3 racer. What are you? He's also a retired NCIS agent and carries a gun on himself 24 hours a day. That should cement your attitude because you are a loser and can't stand winners.

Tell us all what disk bikes you've ridden.
  #14  
Old September 22nd 19, 05:38 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On 9/22/2019 10:38 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.


Campagnolo has always been weak on documentation and
terminology. In this case, 'HO' for a rear changer means the
upper pivot casting OD is minimized to clear a through-axle.

My pet peeves are using 'Record' for twenty or more
different products since 1960[1] and not marking the part
number on the part (something Shimano does rigorously).

[1]Typical telephone call here begins, "I have a Record Whatzit"

"Which Record?"

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #15  
Old September 22nd 19, 06:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,231
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 9:38:45 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 10:38 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.


Campagnolo has always been weak on documentation and
terminology. In this case, 'HO' for a rear changer means the
upper pivot casting OD is minimized to clear a through-axle.

My pet peeves are using 'Record' for twenty or more
different products since 1960[1] and not marking the part
number on the part (something Shimano does rigorously).

[1]Typical telephone call here begins, "I have a Record Whatzit"

"Which Record?"

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with "hydraulically optimized"?

I looked through the manual trying to discover how you would bleed the brakes and there wasn't even anything on how to thread the damn cables though the levers to replace them.

If the Potenza didn't meet my requirements and cost so little I would change over to Shimano.
  #16  
Old September 22nd 19, 08:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:33:42 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, September 21, 2019 at 8:06:14 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 21, 2019 at 6:11:48 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


If you buy the right Potenza lever, it is hydraulic. I can ride over to Universal and get you a set. https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...iABEgJKRvD_BwE

I don't know why you would want to spend $600 USD on hydraulic levers, though.

== Jay Beattie.


The Hydraulic disk Potenza levers are $128 from Bike Kit Pro so when I get the refund back from Wiggl.com I'll call them up and make sure I am ordering the correct part.


You're not ordering the correct part for $128 USD. Look at the site again.


The Potenza levers work like cheap Shimnano levers. You can shift up the cassette 2 or 3 gears at a time but only down one at a time. This might not make a difference with an 11-32 though. Perhaps the ratios are so wide that you don't need to change more than one at a time. I remember that the 8-speeds were like that.


-- Jay Beattie.
  #17  
Old September 22nd 19, 09:35 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On 9/22/2019 12:28 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 9:38:45 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 10:38 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/

Same hub, quick upgrade.

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever. It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.


Campagnolo has always been weak on documentation and
terminology. In this case, 'HO' for a rear changer means the
upper pivot casting OD is minimized to clear a through-axle.

My pet peeves are using 'Record' for twenty or more
different products since 1960[1] and not marking the part
number on the part (something Shimano does rigorously).

[1]Typical telephone call here begins, "I have a Record Whatzit"

"Which Record?"


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with "hydraulically optimized"?

I looked through the manual trying to discover how you would bleed the brakes and there wasn't even anything on how to thread the damn cables though the levers to replace them.

If the Potenza didn't meet my requirements and cost so little I would change over to Shimano.


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have

to do with "hydraulically optimized"?

The first version had an upper pivot casting which could
interfere with big fat through axles.

Space is tight!
http://www.yellowjersey.org/sisend.html

The current "HO" rear changer has a smaller OD on the upper
pivot casting.


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #18  
Old September 23rd 19, 07:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
James[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,153
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On 23/9/19 6:35 am, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 12:28 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 9:38:45 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 10:38 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop
bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until
after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully
expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only
hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2.

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/


Same hub, quick upgrade.

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever.
It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that
has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic
disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and
until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that
they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose
they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from
jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.


Campagnolo has always been weak on documentation and
terminology. In this case, 'HO' for a rear changer means the
upper pivot casting OD is minimized to clear a through-axle.

My pet peeves are using 'Record' for twenty or more
different products since 1960[1] and not marking the part
number on the part (something Shimano does rigorously).

[1]Typical telephone call here begins, "I have a Record Whatzit"

"Which Record?"


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with
"hydraulically optimized"?

I looked through the manual trying to discover how you would bleed the
brakes and there wasn't even anything on how to thread the damn cables
though the levers to replace them.

If the Potenza didn't meet my requirements and cost so little I would
change over to Shimano.


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with

"hydraulically optimized"?

The first version had an upper pivot casting which could interfere with
big fat through axles.

Space is tight!
http://www.yellowjersey.org/sisend.html

The current "HO" rear changer has a smaller OD on the upper pivot casting.



I'm guessing that "big fat through axles" are predominantly used with
(hydraulic) disc brakes?

--
JS
  #19  
Old September 23rd 19, 11:59 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Zen Cycle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 194
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 11:45:17 AM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 5:37:35 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Friday, September 13, 2019 at 1:01:36 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, September 13, 2019 at 9:11:47 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

And why do you want hydro discs? You were claiming they were dangerous
and put you over the bars on your CX bike.


I am sort of upgrading this bike so that my friend who intends to
visit next year will have a bike that fits him.


So, tommy won't ride discs because they're dangerous, but he'll put his friend on a disc-equipped bike he has never ridden.

With friends like tom, you don't need enemies.


On your smartest day you can't even read.


And yet here I am, replying to you in plain english.

I have had several bikes with disk brakes but they are dangerous on
CX bikes and hence on road bikes as well since they can lock the
wheel up so easily.


Yes, WE know. You've written that repeatedly. How does that differ from "tommy won't ride discs because they're dangerous"

And the pads wear so rapidly that you have to check them constantly.


No, they don't, unless you're doing it wrong. But since you think "they are dangerous on CX bikes and hence on road bikes as well since they can lock the wheel up so easily", while the rest of the planet has no problem with them (including me), you're doing it wrong.


My friend is a Cat 3 racer. What are you?


"retied" cat 2 with 142 local wins over the past 30 years. I still race masters open 50+ in road and CX. I cal still pull out a 900 watt sprint at the end of a crit. you?

He's also a retired NCIS agent and carries a gun on himself 24 hours a
day. That should cement your attitude because you are a loser and
can't stand winners.


Are you suggesting that he'd pull his gun on me for speaking my mind? IT wouldn't surprise me he's your friend if that's the case. That's exactly the sort of thing you would pull.


Tell us all what disk bikes you've ridden.


My main CX is a Fort with discs (my pit bike is an old Bontrager Cx, handmade steel before they sold to Trek, not disc)). I also have two mountain bikes with discs - an old Independent Fabrications Custom Deluxe Ti, and my new favorite, a Cannondale Habit 3. I have a KHS tandem that I retrofitted to discs. I go out to Sedona to visit friends on a regular basis and rent a MTB, so have ridden disc bikes out there for the past 6 years.

You're out of your league here, tommy.

  #20  
Old September 23rd 19, 02:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Drop Bar Hydraulic Disk

On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 11:13:21 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 23/9/19 6:35 am, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 12:28 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 9:38:45 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2019 10:38 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 8:07:38 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/21/2019 8:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, September 12, 2019 at 5:20:49 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/12/2019 6:32 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I think that I'm going to change my flat bar bike over to a drop
bar. There were no road shifters with hydraulic brakes until
after I had put it together. (Or maybe they were so frightfully
expensive we didn't move in the same spheres)

The problem appears to be that it is a 10 speed and the only
hydraulic shifter I can find appear to be either 11 speed or Di2..

Were 10 speed hydraulic shifters even made?

I really would hate to have to change over to 11 speeds.

Next time you need a chain/cassette just go to 11:
https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-po...1-speed-ergos/


Same hub, quick upgrade.

Andrew - I ordered that Potenza and it was not a hydraulic lever.
It is something that is called "hydraulically optimized" and that
has something to do with the rear derailleur and not the hydraulic
disk brakes it appears.

It is made to use rim brakes or cable operated disks.


Is this what you received?
https://www.bike24.com/p2230094.html


No, that is the correct one. You gave me a difference reference and
until I read the entry in on the right side I didn't realize that
they call the rear derailleur "hydraulically optimized." I suppose
they use some sort of liquid shock absorber to keep the chain from
jumping about on those very large ratio downshifts.

It is a lot cheaper from ProBikeKit too.


Campagnolo has always been weak on documentation and
terminology. In this case, 'HO' for a rear changer means the
upper pivot casting OD is minimized to clear a through-axle.

My pet peeves are using 'Record' for twenty or more
different products since 1960[1] and not marking the part
number on the part (something Shimano does rigorously).

[1]Typical telephone call here begins, "I have a Record Whatzit"

"Which Record?"


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with
"hydraulically optimized"?

I looked through the manual trying to discover how you would bleed the
brakes and there wasn't even anything on how to thread the damn cables
though the levers to replace them.

If the Potenza didn't meet my requirements and cost so little I would
change over to Shimano.


That is really odd - what does the oversized axles have to do with

"hydraulically optimized"?

The first version had an upper pivot casting which could interfere with
big fat through axles.

Space is tight!
http://www.yellowjersey.org/sisend.html

The current "HO" rear changer has a smaller OD on the upper pivot casting.



I'm guessing that "big fat through axles" are predominantly used with
(hydraulic) disc brakes?


Seems like a reasonable guess. Shimano just uses a different RD design now with no need for a special model for through axles. Rather than a different model RD, it just launched its whole new gravel group -- which I think is ugly. https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/shi...pset-launched/ The clutch RD is nice, and if I were using monster tires, the revised chain line would be nice, too -- but I'm not.

-- Jay Beattie.

 




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