Bicycles Allowed Use Of Full Lane, The Million Car Challenge Campaign

On Dec 19, 5:15*pm, Jobst Brandt wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:

What do you do when you're riding in a lane that's too narrow to
safely share with a passing car?

I proceed as reasonably out of the way as I can and the driver of the
faster vehicle will hold back until it is safe to pass.

So, if I ride either north or south out of my town by my usual routes,
I have to ride on lanes that are nine feet wide.

Where is "reasonably out of the way" in a nine foot lane? Where is it
in a 12 foot lane with three feet of potholes?

*That's a lot
different from me deciding when the following vehicle should pass
without knowledge about the length of that vehicle, its power or how
good at this the driver is. *The assumption of the OP appears to be
that they are all stupid and dangerous.

My assumption is this: I know far more about this situation than
they do. That's partly because I've been passed by hundreds of
thousands of motorists; any given motorist around here has probably
passes less than a few hundred bicyclists in his life. As icing on
the cake, due to driving SAG duty regularly, I've passed hundreds of
times the cyclists that they have.

Furthermore, their bad judgment or lesser knowledge can cause me
serious harm. So I have the knowledge, and I'm more at risk. I'll
take charge, thank you.

It's no more high-handed or offensive on my part than, say, e-mailing
someone with unsolicited advice on writing style - something I would
never do, BTW.

- Frank Krygowski

On Dec 19, 9:14*pm, Gary wrote:
On Dec 19, 5:14*pm, Jay Beattie wrote:





On Dec 19, 12:23*pm, Gary wrote:

On Dec 19, 12:00*pm, Peter Smith wrote:

On Dec 19, 11:24 am, Ronko wrote:

In article 997cd1ed-bf2b-4a16-8b04-
,
says...

BAUFL launched a bicycle awareness campaign this week at

http://www.baufl.org/. The mission is to get one million cars driving around with one
million stickers that say bicycles allowed use if full lane and to
advertise the message on web sites and magazine ads. It's something
every cyclist can do to make drivers aware of cyclists right to use
the roads. I'm in, are you?

In California the relevant part of the Vehicle Code is VC21202.
Paraphrasing, it states a bicycle may have full use of the lane if you can go
at "the normal speed of traffic". Otherwise you should be over to the right
so long as it is safe. If it is not safe then you can use the full lane. There is
more and the law and worth reading.

This is a bad policy/campagin of BAUFL or whatever organization this really
is. Unless your Tour De France material, no amateur bicyclists can ride at
25mph or greater as an average speed. Blocking traffic is unsafe for both
yourself and people in cars. Its rude and on one lane roads forces cars to go
over the double yellow line.

This "campaign" is idiotic, unsafe and will fosrter more discord between
motor vehicles drivers and bicyclists.

They aren't saying that you should take the lane at all times, just
that you're entitled to the lane as you state in your message. *If
conditions drive me into the lane, I don't want to be contending with
drivers who think they'll be within their rights to run me over.
Unfortunately, that's the mindset that exists among many drivers, and
I believe that this mindset is all that this campaign is trying to
confront.

The stickers do not say "Cyclists should block cars whenever
possible."

I don't understand your and JB's protests except within the context of
the Forrester vs others culture war. *The stickers aren't printed for
them - they're for drivers to read.

P- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Peter,

Thats exactly it. The laws are there for everyone to operate safely on
the road. The new federal Bicycles May Use Full Lane signs were just
added to the MUTCD this week. A campaign like this is to create
awareness of the laws that mandated these signs to be used in all
states. As you can see there will be people that disaprove of those
signs being used on the road or anywhere on print or bumpers of cars
for cars to read.
States still may use their own versions as seen on the BAUFL site. The
campaign is clearly aimed at spreading the word about these issues and
not about how someone rides a bike. Still for now most people are
unaware of the laws of with regard to bicycle use on the road.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

But that is clearly not the law under the UVC which provides that
bicyclists must stay as far right as practicable and that slow moving
vehicles must yield. *Here is the Oregon version:

814.430 Improper use of lanes; exceptions; penalty. (1) A person
commits the offense of improper use of lanes by a bicycle if the
person is operating a bicycle on a roadway at less than the normal
speed of traffic using the roadway at that time and place under the
existing conditions and the person does not ride as close as
practicable to the right curb or edge of the roadway.

* * * (2) A person is not in violation of the offense under this
section if the person is not operating a bicycle as close as
practicable to the right curb or edge of the roadway under any of the
following circumstances:

* * * (a) When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle that
is proceeding in the same direction.

* * * (b) When preparing to execute a left turn.

* * * (c) When reasonably necessary to avoid hazardous conditions
including, but not limited to, fixed or moving objects, parked or
moving vehicles, bicycles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards or
other conditions that make continued operation along the right curb or
edge unsafe or to avoid unsafe operation in a lane on the roadway that
is too narrow for a bicycle and vehicle to travel safely side by side.
Nothing in this paragraph excuses the operator of a bicycle from the
requirements under ORS 811.425 or from the penalties for failure to
comply with those requirements.

* * * (d) When operating within a city as near as practicable to the
left curb or edge of a roadway that is designated to allow traffic to
move in only one direction along the roadway. A bicycle that is
operated under this paragraph is subject to the same requirements and
exceptions when operating along the left curb or edge as are
applicable when a bicycle is operating along the right curb or edge of
the roadway.

* * * (e) When operating a bicycle alongside not more than one other
bicycle as long as the bicycles are both being operated within a
single lane and in a manner that does not impede the normal and
reasonable movement of traffic.

* * * (f) When operating on a bicycle lane or bicycle path.

* * * (3) The offense described in this section, improper use of lanes
by a bicycle, is a Class D traffic violation. [1983 c.338 §701; 1985 c.
16 §339]

* * * * A bicycle may "take the lane" under limited circumstances,
e.g., when moving the speed of traffic or preparing for a left turn
(depending on the local version of the UVC). *A bicyclist clearly may
not sit in the middle of the lane promenading at 15mph -- not without
a parade permit. *The idea of a "national" or federal law that allows
bicyclists to take the lane is nonsense since the Commerce Clause does
not reach that far, and *anyway, it would be bad policy to allow
bicyclists to take the lane at their whim and fancy. The current UVC
is a reasonable compromise that keeps traffic flowing. -- Jay Beattie.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Jay,

I don't think any responsible cyclist would violate the code at their
whim or fancy unless they did not understand the law. (The key word is
responsible) ORS 314.430 (2) (c) clearly allows a cyclist to ride
safely in the lane when a lane is too narrow to accomodate a vehicle
and a bicycle. As clear as can be written. As in every state once the
cyclist has either reached a safe area to turn out or designated
turnout then the slow moving codes may apply like ORS 811.425. *No
different than operating any other vehicle under the code. No Parade
permit is required. Really. Never heard of an applicable "national" or
federal law that would apply to state vehicle code with regard to
bicycles either. Where did that come from?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

In your post below, you are taking about "federal regulatory signs and
laws." I suspect that NHTSA or Federal DOT has guidlines, but I would
be surprised if they had authority to impose signage on intrastate
roadways. Perhaps you mean "uniform signs and laws" that are adopted
on a state by state basis, like the UVC.

My point was that, subject to the exceptions stated in the UVC, a
bicyclist must ride as far right as practicable. One can always argue
that the road is "too narrow" or dangerous and that the bicyclist has
the "right" to take the lane (subject to slow moving vehicle laws),
but BMUFL is supposedely "spreading a message" via signs and bumper
stickers that bikes can take the full lane, which is simply not true
most of the time.

Now, if the proposed sign is simply offered as a template that can be
used by local regulators to mark specific areas where the lane has
been designated as too narrow or local regulators have passed
ordinances requiring cyclists to take the lane (as part of traffic
calming or as a safety measure, for example), then that's perfectly
fine. It's like a million other, somewhat uniform traffic signs
telling us what to do under specific circumstances -- or warning us of
deer popping wheelies or trucks parked on wedges of cheese.

I see people everyday riding in the middle of the road at sub-traffic
speeds in downtown PDX for no particular reason. They cause the
traffic to clot, which makes it hard for me on a bike because I have
to work to get around the clot. These people apparently (and wrongly)
believe they can take the whole lane and go slowly, which drives me
nuts. I'm definitely with Jobst on this one, although I don't buy in
to the big black truck conspiracy.-- Jay Beattie

Frank Krygowski wrote:
What do you do when you're riding in a lane that's too narrow to
safely share with a passing car?

I pull over (and often stop and get my bicycle and me off the road
entirely as it's a very narrow road).

If I was all that fussed about those few seconds it takes me to do that,
I'd drive a car myself!

----
www.slowbicyclemovement.org - enjoy the ride

On Dec 20, 3:36*pm, Jim A wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
What do you do when you're riding in a lane that's too narrow to
safely share with a passing car?

I pull over (and often stop and get my bicycle and me off the road
entirely as it's a very narrow road).

If I was all that fussed about those few seconds it takes me to do that,
I'd drive a car myself!

So how often do you pull over like that? Specifically, do you do it
for every car that comes up behind?

I suppose I could do it riding my usual route north. That's a
residential collector that's usually low traffic. I might need to
stop for only one car at a time, perhaps three times in the first
mile. But on the ride south, I'd normally have to wait before pulling
onto the main road for, oh, two minutes until there were no cars
within range. Then I'd stop and pull off again after about 1/4 mile
while the first convoy of cars passed. In thirty seconds to a minute,
I might be able to get back on the road and make it another quarter
mile before pulling off again. And depending where I was going, that
might continue for about a mile, maybe two or three.

Is that _really_ how you ride? Or do you just not have to deal with
narrow lanes?

- Frank Krygowski

In article ,
"Barry" wrote:

Also you are obliged to pull over, stop and allow
backed up traffic to pass. My recollection is five
vehicles staked up and you _must_ pull over. Let's
see ...

Turning Out of Slow-Moving Vehicles

21656. On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe
because of traffic in the opposite direction or other
conditions, a slow-moving vehicle, including a
passenger vehicle, behind which five or more vehicles
are formed in line, shall turn off the roadway at the
nearest place designated as a turnout by signs erected
by the authority having jurisdiction over the highway,
or wherever sufficient area for a safe turnout exists,
in order to permit the vehicles following it to
proceed. As used in this section a slow-moving vehicle
is one which is proceeding at a rate of speed less than
the normal flow of traffic at the particular time and
place.

But apparently a bicycle is not considered a vehicle:

670. A "vehicle" is a device by which any person or property may be
propelled, moved, or drawn upon a highway, excepting a device moved
exclusively by human power or used exclusively upon stationary rails or
tracks.

Only apparently. You did not try very hard.
Bicyclists are subject to the articles that I copied out.

21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway
has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions
applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division,
including, but not limited to, provisions concerning
driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or
drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section
20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with
Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section
40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section
42000), except those provisions which by their very
nature can have no application.

Infractions
40000.1. Except as otherwise provided in this article,
it is unlawful and constitutes an infraction for any
person to violate, or fail to comply with any provision
of this code, or any local ordinance adopted pursuant
to this code.

--
Michael Press

On Dec 20, 2:36*pm, Jim A wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
What do you do when you're riding in a lane that's too narrow to
safely share with a passing car?

I pull over (and often stop and get my bicycle and me off the road
entirely as it's a very narrow road).

If I was all that fussed about those few seconds it takes me to do that,
I'd drive a car myself!

I do that in winter.

Here, there is enough packed snow on the roads that
"taking the lane" is about the only way to safely ride, even
with studded tires.

The intersections tend to be a little wider, due to turning cars.

So if there is an automobile behind me, I try to pull over at
an intersection and wave them ahead of me.

Depending on road conditions, sometimes "taking the lane"
is necessary. Similar to how, in winter, some two lane roads
around here turn into one lane roads for automobiles.

-- Jesse

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Dec 20, 3:36 pm, Jim A wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
What do you do when you're riding in a lane that's too narrow to
safely share with a passing car?
I pull over (and often stop and get my bicycle and me off the road
entirely as it's a very narrow road).

If I was all that fussed about those few seconds it takes me to do that,
I'd drive a car myself!

So how often do you pull over like that? Specifically, do you do it
for every car that comes up behind?

About twice a week I guess. And yes, unless I'm just reaching the end
of the narrow road anyway.

I suppose I could do it riding my usual route north. That's a
residential collector that's usually low traffic. I might need to
stop for only one car at a time, perhaps three times in the first
mile. But on the ride south, I'd normally have to wait before pulling
onto the main road for, oh, two minutes until there were no cars
within range. Then I'd stop and pull off again after about 1/4 mile
while the first convoy of cars passed. In thirty seconds to a minute,
I might be able to get back on the road and make it another quarter
mile before pulling off again. And depending where I was going, that
might continue for about a mile, maybe two or three.

Is that _really_ how you ride?

Yes.

Or do you just not have to deal with
narrow lanes?

Every day. It sounds like mine has a somewhat lower volume of traffic
than yours though! :-) Some days I don't see another vehicle in either
direction.

I think I'm probably trying to compare chalk with cheese here!

--
www.slowbicyclemovement.org - enjoy the ride

On Dec 20, 1:13 pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article ,



"Barry" wrote:
Also you are obliged to pull over, stop and allow
backed up traffic to pass. My recollection is five
vehicles staked up and you _must_ pull over. Let's
see ...

Turning Out of Slow-Moving Vehicles

21656. On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe
because of traffic in the opposite direction or other
conditions, a slow-moving vehicle, including a
passenger vehicle, behind which five or more vehicles
are formed in line, shall turn off the roadway at the
nearest place designated as a turnout by signs erected
by the authority having jurisdiction over the highway,
or wherever sufficient area for a safe turnout exists,
in order to permit the vehicles following it to
proceed. As used in this section a slow-moving vehicle
is one which is proceeding at a rate of speed less than
the normal flow of traffic at the particular time and
place.

But apparently a bicycle is not considered a vehicle:

670. A "vehicle" is a device by which any person or property may be
propelled, moved, or drawn upon a highway, excepting a device moved
exclusively by human power or used exclusively upon stationary rails or
tracks.

Only apparently. You did not try very hard.
Bicyclists are subject to the articles that I copied out.

21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway
has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions
applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division,
including, but not limited to, provisions concerning
driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or
drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section
20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with
Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section
40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section
42000), except those provisions which by their very
nature can have no application.

Infractions
40000.1. Except as otherwise provided in this article,
it is unlawful and constitutes an infraction for any
person to violate, or fail to comply with any provision
of this code, or any local ordinance adopted pursuant
to this code.

--
Michael Press

Here's one interpretation in one jurisdiction:

http://stc-law.com/slowmoving.html

In article
,
Dan O wrote:

On Dec 20, 1:13 pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article ,



"Barry" wrote:
Also you are obliged to pull over, stop and allow
backed up traffic to pass. My recollection is five
vehicles staked up and you _must_ pull over. Let's
see ...

Turning Out of Slow-Moving Vehicles

21656. On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe
because of traffic in the opposite direction or other
conditions, a slow-moving vehicle, including a
passenger vehicle, behind which five or more vehicles
are formed in line, shall turn off the roadway at the
nearest place designated as a turnout by signs erected
by the authority having jurisdiction over the highway,
or wherever sufficient area for a safe turnout exists,
in order to permit the vehicles following it to
proceed. As used in this section a slow-moving vehicle
is one which is proceeding at a rate of speed less than
the normal flow of traffic at the particular time and
place.

But apparently a bicycle is not considered a vehicle:

670. A "vehicle" is a device by which any person or property may be
propelled, moved, or drawn upon a highway, excepting a device moved
exclusively by human power or used exclusively upon stationary rails or
tracks.

Only apparently. You did not try very hard.
Bicyclists are subject to the articles that I copied out.

21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway
has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions
applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division,
including, but not limited to, provisions concerning
driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or
drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section
20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with
Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section
40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section
42000), except those provisions which by their very
nature can have no application.

Infractions
40000.1. Except as otherwise provided in this article,
it is unlawful and constitutes an infraction for any
person to violate, or fail to comply with any provision
of this code, or any local ordinance adopted pursuant
to this code.

Here's one interpretation in one jurisdiction:

http://stc-law.com/slowmoving.html

How does that document read?

--
Michael Press

On Dec 20, 2:19*pm, Dan O wrote:
On Dec 20, 1:13 pm, Michael Press wrote:





In article ,

*"Barry" wrote:
Also you are obliged to pull over, stop and allow
backed up traffic to pass. My recollection is five
vehicles staked up and you _must_ pull over. Let's
see ...

Turning Out of Slow-Moving Vehicles

21656. On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe
because of traffic in the opposite direction or other
conditions, a slow-moving vehicle, including a
passenger vehicle, behind which five or more vehicles
are formed in line, shall turn off the roadway at the
nearest place designated as a turnout by signs erected
by the authority having jurisdiction over the highway,
or wherever sufficient area for a safe turnout exists,
in order to permit the vehicles following it to
proceed. As used in this section a slow-moving vehicle
is one which is proceeding at a rate of speed less than
the normal flow of traffic at the particular time and
place.

But apparently a bicycle is not considered a vehicle:

670. *A "vehicle" is a device by which any person or property may be
propelled, moved, or drawn upon a highway, excepting a device moved
exclusively by human power or used exclusively upon stationary rails or
tracks.

Only apparently. You did not try very hard.
Bicyclists are subject to the articles that I copied out.

21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway
has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions
applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division,
including, but not limited to, provisions concerning
driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or
drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section
20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with
Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section
40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section
42000), except those provisions which by their very
nature can have no application.

Infractions
40000.1. Except as otherwise provided in this article,
it is unlawful and constitutes an infraction for any
person to violate, or fail to comply with any provision
of this code, or any local ordinance adopted pursuant
to this code.

--
Michael Press

Here's one interpretation in one jurisdiction:

I think Ray forgot to account for the fact that ORS 814.430(2)(c)
specifically incorporates the slow moving vehicle law, ORS 811.425.
ORS 814.430(2)(c) provides:

(c) When reasonably necessary to avoid hazardous conditions
including, but not limited to, fixed or moving objects, parked or
moving vehicles, bicycles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards or
other conditions that make continued operation along the right curb
or
edge unsafe or to avoid unsafe operation in a lane on the roadway
that
is too narrow for a bicycle and vehicle to travel safely side by
side.
Nothing in this paragraph excuses the operator of a bicycle from the
requirements under ORS 811.425 or from the penalties for failure to
comply with those requirements.

If ORS 811.525 did not apply to bicycles, then there would be no need
to reference it in ORS 814.430. Moreover, the Oregon Court of Appeals
rejected Ray's argument in State v. Potter 185 Or.App. 81, 86, 57 P.
3d 944 (2002) (upholding conviction of cyclist for impeding traffic,
ORS 811.130).


Ray also omits any mention of ORS 811.065 -- which may have been
adopted after he wrote the article. I remember talking to him a few
years ago about the new statute, and he may have even testified at the
legislature, so he certainly knows about it. Here's the statute:

811.065 Unsafe passing of person operating bicycle; penalty. (1) A
driver of a motor vehicle commits the offense of unsafe passing of a
person operating a bicycle if the driver violates any of the following
requirements:

(a) The driver of a motor vehicle may only pass a person
operating a bicycle by driving to the left of the bicycle at a safe
distance and returning to the lane of travel once the motor vehicle is
safely clear of the overtaken bicycle. For the purposes of this
paragraph, a “safe distance” means a distance that is sufficient to
prevent contact with the person operating the bicycle if the person
were to fall into the driver’s lane of traffic. This paragraph does
not apply to a driver operating a motor vehicle:

(A) In a lane that is separate from and adjacent to a designated
bicycle lane;

(B) At a speed not greater than 35 miles per hour; or

(C) When the driver is passing a person operating a bicycle on
the person’s right side and the person operating the bicycle is
turning left.

(b) The driver of a motor vehicle may drive to the left of the
center of a roadway to pass a person operating a bicycle proceeding in
the same direction only if the roadway to the left of the center is
unobstructed for a sufficient distance to permit the driver to pass
the person operating the bicycle safely and avoid interference with
oncoming traffic. This paragraph does not authorize driving on the
left side of the center of a roadway when prohibited under ORS
811.295, 811.300 or 811.310 to 811.325.

(c) The driver of a motor vehicle that passes a person operating
a bicycle shall return to an authorized lane of traffic as soon as
practicable.

(2) Passing a person operating a bicycle in a no passing zone in
violation of ORS 811.420 constitutes prima facie evidence of
commission of the offense described in this section, unsafe passing of
a person operating a bicycle, if the passing results in injury to or
the death of the person operating the bicycle.

(3) The offense described in this section, unsafe passing of a
person operating a bicycle, is a Class B traffic violation. [2007 c.
794 §2]

So, "the bicycle passing law" makes it clear that a car cannot cross
the center line in a no-passing zone to get around a bicycle. Since
much of Skyline is no passing, a bicycle would be treated as a slow
moving vehicle and would be required to pull off and let cars pass or
else be subject to a traffic citation for impeding traffic.

This is all hypothetical, though, since cars have been passing me on
Skyline (with and without trailers) for the last 25 years with few if
any problems. I seriously doubt that PPB or MCSD would issue a
citation to a driver who went over the center line in a no-passing
zone to get safely around a bike, so long as it was safe to do so. --
Jay Beattie.