Another Case of those safe CF bikes

On Monday, June 26, 2017 at 9:30:17 AM UTC-7, Claus Aßmann wrote:
Then you should love your $10,000 carbon fiber bike.

Envious much?

Why? I had four top of the line carbon bikes. One of them is so flexy that you can't ride it on a rough downhill, another was so stiff it is unrideable on anything but perfectly smooth road. A Colnago broke it's fork and threw me against a rock wall at 25 mph. A week later my friend's Colnago had the entire steering tube simply fall off. He is a permanent cripple now. A carbon fork fell apart while I was riding at about 5 mph dumping me on my face and giving me a concussion so that I was walking around like a zombie for 2 1/2 years. I don't have any memory of half of my life and have to take anti-seizure drugs for the remainder of my life.

But you think that I should be envious of you for daring those things? Actually I'm laughing at you for risking your life for no good reason.

How do you know what kind of bike(s) I have?
Maybe I have 4 steel bikes?
For example, a shopping bike, a rain bike,
a commuter, a "road" bike.

Or maybe I have "no name" CF bike(s)?

Oh well...

If you rode steel bikes you wouldn't be so adamantly supporting CF as if it's God's gift to humanity.

After all - you had a "quality" German bicycle that broke a fork. I never saw a quality German bicycle if you'll excuse me. (I might note that I've never seen an English bike in that category as well.) All of the top of the line were about the same quality as Schwinn - not bad and the upper levels were fairly good, but hardly what you would call "quality" except for a Paramount a year here and another there. And even those being mass produced could not be trusted as you would a Masi or a Simonetti. The modern French bikes look very good though they seem to be a little heavier than the Italian bikes.

The comparison is this - if you are paying $10,000 for a bicycle you expect them to be the best. So you can only compare them with other bicycles at the very top of the tables. My friend just paid $5,000 for a custom made steel race bike with a Campy group on it. It weighs 20 lbs. My Basso is 22.6 lbs. But also my bike is 4 cm larger than his. And my Campy group is 8 years old. And I have new Continental Gatorskins on it. The Michelin Pro4 Endurance tires are lighter, have noticeably better traction and are belted like the Gatorskin.

Of all of the bikes I've ever ridden absolutely NOTHING has compared to the two or three Basso's I've owned over the years. This one I intend to keep for life.

... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

On 6/26/2017 8:50 PM, Doug Landau wrote:
... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

I'm in Northeast Ohio. My kid lived in Portland for years.

Back then, I looked up climate data and found the two areas seemed
rather similar in overall annual averages. But in practice, summer and
winter are very different there.

One big difference seems to be this: when NE Ohio gets summer heat, it
comes up from the Gulf of Mexico and is soaked with humidity. 90
Fahrenheit can feel like 100. But when Portland gets summer heat, it
comes up from near-desert areas. The humidity is much lower.

Example: This Friday, both Jay's area and my area are predicted to have
a high temperature of 83 degrees in the afternoon. But Jay's humidity
is predicted to be 38% with a dew point of 55 Fahrenheit. Our humidity
is predicted to be 59% with a dew point of 67.

Dew points anywhere above 60 feel muggy. 67 will feel like a swamp.
Sweat won't evaporate, and a one mile ride to the local beer store will
have me literally dripping.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Monday, June 26, 2017 at 8:13:53 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/26/2017 8:50 PM, Doug Landau wrote:
... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

I'm in Northeast Ohio. My kid lived in Portland for years.

Back then, I looked up climate data and found the two areas seemed
rather similar in overall annual averages. But in practice, summer and
winter are very different there.

One big difference seems to be this: when NE Ohio gets summer heat, it
comes up from the Gulf of Mexico and is soaked with humidity. 90
Fahrenheit can feel like 100. But when Portland gets summer heat, it
comes up from near-desert areas. The humidity is much lower.

Example: This Friday, both Jay's area and my area are predicted to have
a high temperature of 83 degrees in the afternoon. But Jay's humidity
is predicted to be 38% with a dew point of 55 Fahrenheit. Our humidity
is predicted to be 59% with a dew point of 67.

Dew points anywhere above 60 feel muggy. 67 will feel like a swamp.
Sweat won't evaporate, and a one mile ride to the local beer store will
have me literally dripping.

Errrr - Frank - I think that Doug is talking about Portland, OR. After a really wet and cold winter we're having a rather warm June. July bodes cooler than normal.

On Monday, June 26, 2017 at 8:13:53 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/26/2017 8:50 PM, Doug Landau wrote:
... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

I'm in Northeast Ohio. My kid lived in Portland for years.

Back then, I looked up climate data and found the two areas seemed
rather similar in overall annual averages. But in practice, summer and
winter are very different there.

One big difference seems to be this: when NE Ohio gets summer heat, it
comes up from the Gulf of Mexico and is soaked with humidity. 90
Fahrenheit can feel like 100. But when Portland gets summer heat, it
comes up from near-desert areas. The humidity is much lower.

Example: This Friday, both Jay's area and my area are predicted to have
a high temperature of 83 degrees in the afternoon. But Jay's humidity
is predicted to be 38% with a dew point of 55 Fahrenheit. Our humidity
is predicted to be 59% with a dew point of 67.

Dew points anywhere above 60 feel muggy. 67 will feel like a swamp.
Sweat won't evaporate, and a one mile ride to the local beer store will
have me literally dripping.

It typically isn't that muggy, but it can be on rare occasion, but not like the Midwest or anywhere east of the Rockies. No cicadas or fireflies either. No mid-afternoon summer squalls and lightning storms, although we had some brief rain and lightning yesterday -- which was a nice respite from the heat.
It goes to show you how wimpy I am when, after a two day heat wave, I'm happy to get a little rain.

Where Doug lives is perfect weather and riding, and it smells good, too. I miss the smell of bay and eucalyptus. Fir forests smell so bland.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 2017-06-25 21:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, June 25, 2017 at 7:57:00 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/25/2017 7:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
Final descent was this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqllO_J9_wA The bike didn't
explode.

I will say, I find fast descents in dappled bright sunshine to be
scary. It's very hard to spot potholes in time, at least with my
old eyes.

Scarier with dark sun glasses, which I was wearing today
(prescription, not fashion). Germantown Road is well paved, so it's
pretty low consequence except for the cars. No close calls. No heroic
stories, although I could make some up.

My son had an eventful day. He was doing all these spur roads off of
Big Cottonwood Canyon in SLC and had a rear-tire blow out. He didn't
notice that he had a sidewall cut and went through two tubes and all
his CO2 before he figured it out. Life lesson. Luckily, he got a ride
from a nice stranger to the bottom of the canyon and then a friend
picked him up. He was on expensive Conti Grand Prix which I think are
prone to sidewall damage. I know people disagree, but I don't buy
them because I got sidewall cuts and Pro Race are so much cheaper.


My experience with Conti Gatorskins is similar. Aside from being
undersized and a bear to mount onto shallow rims I had too many
premature side wall failures. These are not cheap and when you have to
trash an otherwise perfectly good tire at 1000mi because the side wall
is gone that is sad. When one held I could milk 2500mi out of them on
the rear before the tread was through.

I switched to CST Conquistare but their tread wears much faster. Cost
less than half though. Way better side wall sturdiness.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Monday, June 26, 2017 at 8:13:53 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/26/2017 8:50 PM, Doug Landau wrote:
... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

I'm in Northeast Ohio. My kid lived in Portland for years.

Back then, I looked up climate data and found the two areas seemed
rather similar in overall annual averages. But in practice, summer and
winter are very different there.

One big difference seems to be this: when NE Ohio gets summer heat, it
comes up from the Gulf of Mexico and is soaked with humidity. 90
Fahrenheit can feel like 100. But when Portland gets summer heat, it
comes up from near-desert areas. The humidity is much lower.

So it's the same thing that goes on in SF - the air over the interior usually heats n rises allowing ocean air to come in, but on the very hottest days it not only rises but pushes outwards over the ocean, too

I've never been to portland. I've ridden down the coast. When it's 100 in portland is it also 100 in Astoria, Seaside?

On Tuesday, June 27, 2017 at 7:44:33 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-06-25 21:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, June 25, 2017 at 7:57:00 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/25/2017 7:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
Final descent was this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqllO_J9_wA The bike didn't
explode.

I will say, I find fast descents in dappled bright sunshine to be
scary. It's very hard to spot potholes in time, at least with my
old eyes.

Scarier with dark sun glasses, which I was wearing today
(prescription, not fashion). Germantown Road is well paved, so it's
pretty low consequence except for the cars. No close calls. No heroic
stories, although I could make some up.

My son had an eventful day. He was doing all these spur roads off of
Big Cottonwood Canyon in SLC and had a rear-tire blow out. He didn't
notice that he had a sidewall cut and went through two tubes and all
his CO2 before he figured it out. Life lesson. Luckily, he got a ride
from a nice stranger to the bottom of the canyon and then a friend
picked him up. He was on expensive Conti Grand Prix which I think are
prone to sidewall damage. I know people disagree, but I don't buy
them because I got sidewall cuts and Pro Race are so much cheaper.


My experience with Conti Gatorskins is similar. Aside from being
undersized and a bear to mount onto shallow rims I had too many
premature side wall failures. These are not cheap and when you have to
trash an otherwise perfectly good tire at 1000mi because the side wall
is gone that is sad. When one held I could milk 2500mi out of them on
the rear before the tread was through.

I switched to CST Conquistare but their tread wears much faster. Cost
less than half though. Way better side wall sturdiness.

You can get the latest Michelin Power Endurance tires for only a little less than the Gatorskins. So far the Pro4 Endurance tires have impressed the hell out of me.

https://www.merlincycles.com/micheli...YaAlsK8P8 HAQ

What impresses me the most is that I've gotten only one flat and it was from a goat's head thorn. The traction is a LOT better on the road than Gatorskins are. Though the long term wear I can't tell yet.

On Tuesday, June 27, 2017 at 9:19:15 AM UTC-7, Doug Landau wrote:
On Monday, June 26, 2017 at 8:13:53 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/26/2017 8:50 PM, Doug Landau wrote:
... Yes, Portland can get hot -- 98 today, 102 tomorrow.

Oh wow I did not know that

I'm in Northeast Ohio. My kid lived in Portland for years.

Back then, I looked up climate data and found the two areas seemed
rather similar in overall annual averages. But in practice, summer and
winter are very different there.

One big difference seems to be this: when NE Ohio gets summer heat, it
comes up from the Gulf of Mexico and is soaked with humidity. 90
Fahrenheit can feel like 100. But when Portland gets summer heat, it
comes up from near-desert areas. The humidity is much lower.

So it's the same thing that goes on in SF - the air over the interior usually heats n rises allowing ocean air to come in, but on the very hottest days it not only rises but pushes outwards over the ocean, too

I've never been to portland. I've ridden down the coast. When it's 100 in portland is it also 100 in Astoria, Seaside?

When it gets hot in the valley the wind blows like hell. Sunday the wind was so strong that on a 4% downgrade I couldn't get over 14/15 mph.

I think I am recovering from a bad start to the year and am beginning to get some riding strength back.

On 6/24/2017 3:50 PM, wrote:
The 2017 Tour of Flanders....

This rider was involved in a single rider crash on a city street lined with people and NO obstructions to run into.

The Bahrain Merida Pro Cycling Team rides Merida bikes, specifically the Scultura Team and Reacto Team model bikes. Both are full carbon fiber.

I have a picture but of course we cannot post pictures here.

Use Tinypic.com and post a link.

The bike broke about 5 inches above the bottom bracket on the down tube and about the same distance from the seat tube on the top tube. It appears that he was uninjured which suggests that he fell into the street lining crowd.

We know that anyone that rides a CF bike is more interested in saving a couple of lbs rather than his own safety but then that is a problem that will solve itself.

This is unusual since racers typically replace their bicycles often, so
they don't experience the failures that occur after the frame has been
subjected to events that would lead to CF failure. There must have been
a hidden defect in that frame.

There's no hard and fast rule, some carbon frames break after just a
year, some can go for a decade or more, but the conventional wisdom is
to replace the frame and fork every three years to be on the safe side.
Otherwise you're going to spend more trying to detect flaws that it's
worth, both in time and money/