Probably a waste of my time but its my time to waste

Jeff Grippe wrote:
Top post, no problem.

Jim,

Just so we get my POV correct, however, the behavior of Ed Gin is completely
unacceptable. The behavior of ED is simply ED doing what ED does. I have no
problem with self-expression that I don't happen to agree with.

As many people have pointed out, there are mechanisms available to filter
out ED's posting if that is what you want to do.

I stand by my description of the cause/effect relationship but I also
believe that Ed Gin (or whoever it is) has crossed a line that ED has not.

Most of the time I have said that it is my opinion that ED is welcome. I
don't feel that way about the ST. There is a line that ST has crossed that
ED has not.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...
Jeff,

Pardon the top post. I have to agree with virtually all you have had
to say with but a singular exception. If the group has become what Ed
Dolan has made it and the spamming posts are a reaction to what he
created and without him there would be no such postings, that doesn't
account for why I am also the focus and target of these posts
especially since I was if anything an adversary of Dolan's and even
defended Ed Gin when Dolan asserted that Ed Gin's website hosted
pornographic images when it most assuredly did not..

Jim McNamara

Jeff Grippe wrote:
To Ed,

For a long time I have taken the position that you should be welcomed to
this group. Actually my position has been that everyone should be
welcome. I
don't really think that has changed. However,

It is difficult to imagine that you can not see that group has become
what
you have made of it.

You have taken pride in being the "All Time Poster" in terms of number of
messages. I think that means that you have left a pretty big stamp on the
group. jwold, Ed Gin, or whatever his (or her) name is, is a reaction to
what you have created. Without Ed Dolan there would be no jwold postings.

While the idea of "Fight Fire With Fire" is a well know cliche, when you
actually do it, you end up with a bigger fire. If it is fire you want
then
it is fire you've got. But don't pretend that you have nothing to do with
it.

If the group happens to be composed of mostly liberals then that is what
the
group is made up of. It really isn't your place to decide what points of
view are welcome and what points of view are not.

What this group has become is what you, the all time, number one poster,
has
made it.

I am certain that you will respond to this post as you respond to just
about
everything.

For the record, I have no intention of carrying on a dialog with you
about
the point's I've raised in this posting. It is a pointless exercise as is
this message itself I suppose. This means that I will not respond to
anything that you answer and I don't think I'll start another thread
since I
don't have anything else to add.

As I always have (and always will), I wish you well.

Jeff


Jeff,

For the most part, you're preachin' to the choir. No arguments here
cconcerning the spamming troll(s) crossing the line and the law for
that matter, including two felony counts. As concerns Dolan, he is
just what and who he is just doing what he takes pleasure in doing, but
contrary to his belief, if you can believe what Ed contends, I dont'
feel that he serves a worthwhile purpose in so doing. He can be rude,
obnoxious, insulting and disruptive and there are times when I feel
ARBR would be a much better place without him, but you already know
that from my posts in the past. Ed's a bright enough and educated
enough guy who could probably be of some benefit if he wasn't so hard
headed in his opinions and so misguided in his objectives. On the
other hand, there is a world of difference between the two Ed's if
indeed Gin is behind any of this nonsense. Dolan's mock threats aren't
to be taken seriously with or without shotgun in hand, but the garbage
that has been spewed by the cowardly spamming troll(s) is insufferable,
inappropriate and condemnable. To his credit, at least Dolan uses his
real name and real email address. He doesn't hide behind a proxy
server and slink on off to a public library to make post for fear of
retaliation or reprisal. What it takes to do what the spaming troll(s)
have shamefully done is a complete and total lack of balls.

Jim McNamara

I think we are basically in agreement.

Since Ed doesn't fight fairly, however, I have chosen not to fight with him
at all. I think that if nobody fought with him at all, his fighting would
diminish. He is very good at pushing people's buttons, however, so it is
likely that there will always be someone to fight with him.

Would we be better off without him? Well maybe but the essence of
unmoderated news groups is that anyone with a computer can post to them.

Some people have expressed the idea that since there is so much talk about
and by Ed on topics unrelated to recumbent cycling, that the group isn't
worth reading.

Anyone who chooses to can do the following:
1. post something on-topic (unlike the nonsense that I'm posting now)
2. filter out most of the off topic stuff

I understand the frustration that many feel with the overbearing behavior
and pontification that is Ed but it is my belief that the best way to
minimize it is to ignore it. Arguing with him keeps him going. The troll did
nothing to diminish him (and he has done nothing to diminish the troll).
Regardless of what you or I do, Ed will be Ed. This is the reason that I
have been silent. I never stopped reading the group but I knew that there
was nothing I had to add that was of any value.

So my advice to you (not that you asked for any) is to ignore Ed's rants.
Only respond to his on-topic posts and then stay on topic. This group is his
soapbox. Do what you would do with anyone on a soapbox that you don't agree
with. Stop listening. Certainly don't try to reason or argue with someone
you know can't be reasoned with.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...

Jeff Grippe wrote:
Top post, no problem.

Jim,

Just so we get my POV correct, however, the behavior of Ed Gin is
completely
unacceptable. The behavior of ED is simply ED doing what ED does. I have
no
problem with self-expression that I don't happen to agree with.

As many people have pointed out, there are mechanisms available to filter
out ED's posting if that is what you want to do.

I stand by my description of the cause/effect relationship but I also
believe that Ed Gin (or whoever it is) has crossed a line that ED has
not.

Most of the time I have said that it is my opinion that ED is welcome. I
don't feel that way about the ST. There is a line that ST has crossed
that
ED has not.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...
Jeff,

Pardon the top post. I have to agree with virtually all you have had
to say with but a singular exception. If the group has become what Ed
Dolan has made it and the spamming posts are a reaction to what he
created and without him there would be no such postings, that doesn't
account for why I am also the focus and target of these posts
especially since I was if anything an adversary of Dolan's and even
defended Ed Gin when Dolan asserted that Ed Gin's website hosted
pornographic images when it most assuredly did not..

Jim McNamara

Jeff Grippe wrote:
To Ed,

For a long time I have taken the position that you should be welcomed
to
this group. Actually my position has been that everyone should be
welcome. I
don't really think that has changed. However,

It is difficult to imagine that you can not see that group has become
what
you have made of it.

You have taken pride in being the "All Time Poster" in terms of number
of
messages. I think that means that you have left a pretty big stamp on
the
group. jwold, Ed Gin, or whatever his (or her) name is, is a reaction
to
what you have created. Without Ed Dolan there would be no jwold
postings.

While the idea of "Fight Fire With Fire" is a well know cliche, when
you
actually do it, you end up with a bigger fire. If it is fire you want
then
it is fire you've got. But don't pretend that you have nothing to do
with
it.

If the group happens to be composed of mostly liberals then that is
what
the
group is made up of. It really isn't your place to decide what points
of
view are welcome and what points of view are not.

What this group has become is what you, the all time, number one
poster,
has
made it.

I am certain that you will respond to this post as you respond to just
about
everything.

For the record, I have no intention of carrying on a dialog with you
about
the point's I've raised in this posting. It is a pointless exercise as
is
this message itself I suppose. This means that I will not respond to
anything that you answer and I don't think I'll start another thread
since I
don't have anything else to add.

As I always have (and always will), I wish you well.

Jeff


Jeff,

For the most part, you're preachin' to the choir. No arguments here
cconcerning the spamming troll(s) crossing the line and the law for
that matter, including two felony counts. As concerns Dolan, he is
just what and who he is just doing what he takes pleasure in doing, but
contrary to his belief, if you can believe what Ed contends, I dont'
feel that he serves a worthwhile purpose in so doing. He can be rude,
obnoxious, insulting and disruptive and there are times when I feel
ARBR would be a much better place without him, but you already know
that from my posts in the past. Ed's a bright enough and educated
enough guy who could probably be of some benefit if he wasn't so hard
headed in his opinions and so misguided in his objectives. On the
other hand, there is a world of difference between the two Ed's if
indeed Gin is behind any of this nonsense. Dolan's mock threats aren't
to be taken seriously with or without shotgun in hand, but the garbage
that has been spewed by the cowardly spamming troll(s) is insufferable,
inappropriate and condemnable. To his credit, at least Dolan uses his
real name and real email address. He doesn't hide behind a proxy
server and slink on off to a public library to make post for fear of
retaliation or reprisal. What it takes to do what the spaming troll(s)
have shamefully done is a complete and total lack of balls.

Jim McNamara

"Jeff Grippe" wrote in message
...

Edward Dolan wrote:

Why he [Jeff Grippe] does not appreciate me more than he does is a very
great mystery to me. That he would equate me with the SPAMMING TROLL is
the ultimate insult. Jeff Grippe needs to reexamine his perspective on
this newsgroup.


I said I wouldn't carry on a discussion about this. Add liar to my list of
qualities.

For the record, I appreciate you quite a bit as I've often said.

I do not equate you with the SPAMMING TROLL.

Regarding the SPAMMING TROLL: I find the actions of the person who has
been posting your and Jim's addresses to be completely deplorable. His
behavior is completely and utterly unacceptable. He is pointlessly vulgar
and serves no other function than to irritate. I would like him to stop
what he is doing.

But Jeff, you are now one of the very few who has said that - and it needs
to be said often and forcefully. If good men say nothing then evil men
prevail. The other stalwarts of ARBR say nothing about the SPAMMING TROLL.
Their silence is deafening to me!

Regarding you: At times I wish you were more civil and willing to engage
in real dialog but it is fine with me if you do what you do. I've stopped
responding to most of what you post.

But don't you miss the intellectual stimulation? As you know, I love to
argue with New York Jews.

What I said and I stand by is that the ST is a reaction to what you have
posted. It is a cause and effect relationship. However, there is nothing
that you've ever said that justifies this type of response.

In Summary:
1. Your behavior lead to the ST

I disagree. The ST would do what he does regardless of me. He did it to Jim
McNamara some years ago too without any provocation whatsoever.

2. The ST's behavior is despicable and should be condemned by all
3. Your behavior is just you being you which has always been fine with me.

In case the ST decides that I now belong in his sites [sights], I am...

Jeff Grippe
23 Chesley Road
White Plains, NY 10605

Jeff, I NOW do have some second thoughts myself about NOT being known
because of various scoundrels and knaves that regularly show up on
newsgroups. Words can't hurt me, but still they can be a nuisance from time
to time.

When I was in New York I only made it to the Bronx just once. I wanted to
see the Grand Concourse. It was still Grand but starting to look a bit run
down. This was in the 1960's.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...

Jeff Grippe wrote:
Top post, no problem.

Jim,

Just so we get my POV correct, however, the behavior of Ed Gin is
completely
unacceptable. The behavior of ED is simply ED doing what ED does. I have
no
problem with self-expression that I don't happen to agree with.

As many people have pointed out, there are mechanisms available to filter
out ED's posting if that is what you want to do.

I stand by my description of the cause/effect relationship but I also
believe that Ed Gin (or whoever it is) has crossed a line that ED has
not.

Most of the time I have said that it is my opinion that ED is welcome. I
don't feel that way about the ST. There is a line that ST has crossed
that
ED has not.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...
Jeff,

Pardon the top post. I have to agree with virtually all you have had
to say with but a singular exception. If the group has become what Ed
Dolan has made it and the spamming posts are a reaction to what he
created and without him there would be no such postings, that doesn't
account for why I am also the focus and target of these posts
especially since I was if anything an adversary of Dolan's and even
defended Ed Gin when Dolan asserted that Ed Gin's website hosted
pornographic images when it most assuredly did not..

Jim McNamara

Jeff Grippe wrote:
To Ed,

For a long time I have taken the position that you should be welcomed
to
this group. Actually my position has been that everyone should be
welcome. I
don't really think that has changed. However,

It is difficult to imagine that you can not see that group has become
what
you have made of it.

You have taken pride in being the "All Time Poster" in terms of number
of
messages. I think that means that you have left a pretty big stamp on
the
group. jwold, Ed Gin, or whatever his (or her) name is, is a reaction
to
what you have created. Without Ed Dolan there would be no jwold
postings.

While the idea of "Fight Fire With Fire" is a well know cliche, when
you
actually do it, you end up with a bigger fire. If it is fire you want
then
it is fire you've got. But don't pretend that you have nothing to do
with
it.

If the group happens to be composed of mostly liberals then that is
what
the
group is made up of. It really isn't your place to decide what points
of
view are welcome and what points of view are not.

What this group has become is what you, the all time, number one
poster,
has
made it.

I am certain that you will respond to this post as you respond to just
about
everything.

For the record, I have no intention of carrying on a dialog with you
about
the point's I've raised in this posting. It is a pointless exercise as
is
this message itself I suppose. This means that I will not respond to
anything that you answer and I don't think I'll start another thread
since I
don't have anything else to add.

As I always have (and always will), I wish you well.

Jeff


Jeff,

For the most part, you're preachin' to the choir. No arguments here
cconcerning the spamming troll(s) crossing the line and the law for
that matter, including two felony counts. As concerns Dolan, he is
just what and who he is just doing what he takes pleasure in doing, but
contrary to his belief, if you can believe what Ed contends, I dont'
feel that he serves a worthwhile purpose in so doing. He can be rude,
obnoxious, insulting and disruptive and there are times when I feel
ARBR would be a much better place without him, but you already know
that from my posts in the past. Ed's a bright enough and educated
enough guy who could probably be of some benefit if he wasn't so hard
headed in his opinions and so misguided in his objectives. On the
other hand, there is a world of difference between the two Ed's if
indeed Gin is behind any of this nonsense. Dolan's mock threats aren't
to be taken seriously with or without shotgun in hand, but the garbage
that has been spewed by the cowardly spamming troll(s) is insufferable,
inappropriate and condemnable. To his credit, at least Dolan uses his
real name and real email address. He doesn't hide behind a proxy
server and slink on off to a public library to make post for fear of
retaliation or reprisal. What it takes to do what the spaming troll(s)
have shamefully done is a complete and total lack of balls.

Jim McNamara

Jim, we have got an ally on our side with Jeff Grippe. Would that this
newsgroup had dozens like him.

Ed Gin does not bother me nearly so much as all those cowards who will not
come out into the open and take a stand. Why do Jon Meinecke and Tom Sherman
ALWAYS take a powder when the ST (SPAMMING TROLL) shows up. It is the
fecklessness of ARBR that drives me to distraction.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"Jeff Grippe" wrote in message
...

ALL TOP POSTERS ARE IDIOTS!

I think we are basically in agreement.

Since Ed doesn't fight fairly, however, I have chosen not to fight with
him at all. I think that if nobody fought with him at all, his fighting
would diminish. He is very good at pushing people's buttons, however, so
it is likely that there will always be someone to fight with him.

That is a very old saw that someone with whom you disagree does not fight
fairly.

Would we be better off without him? Well maybe but the essence of
unmoderated news groups is that anyone with a computer can post to them.

Some people have expressed the idea that since there is so much talk about
and by Ed on topics unrelated to recumbent cycling, that the group isn't
worth reading.

Anyone who chooses to can do the following:
1. post something on-topic (unlike the nonsense that I'm posting now)
2. filter out most of the off topic stuff

I understand the frustration that many feel with the overbearing behavior
and pontification that is Ed but it is my belief that the best way to
minimize it is to ignore it. Arguing with him keeps him going. The troll
did nothing to diminish him (and he has done nothing to diminish the
troll). Regardless of what you or I do, Ed will be Ed. This is the reason
that I have been silent. I never stopped reading the group but I knew that
there was nothing I had to add that was of any value.

It is difficult indeed to make much headway when you are up against a
gigantic intellect such as mine.

So my advice to you (not that you asked for any) is to ignore Ed's rants.
Only respond to his on-topic posts and then stay on topic. This group is
his soapbox. Do what you would do with anyone on a soapbox that you don't
agree with. Stop listening. Certainly don't try to reason or argue with
someone you know can't be reasoned with.

Jim likes to stalk me and never has much to say about any of my content.

By the way, I am the soul of reason, but I am not politically correct about
anything. I make it a point NOT to be politically correct. You should try it
sometime yourself.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

But don't you miss the intellectual stimulation? As you know, I love to
argue with New York Jews.


What intellectual stimulation? You don't stimulate, you pontificate. You are
like a book. Everything you are going to say you have said before. I have
read the book of Ed Dolan many times. The result of debating you will be
nothing new and so no intellectual stimulation will take place. If I found
you intellectually stimulating you would have heard a lot more from me over
the past few years.

That is a very old saw that someone with whom you disagree does not fight
fairly.


Well we could have that discussion again but it is in the archives.


It is difficult indeed to make much headway when you are up against a
gigantic intellect such as mine.


ibid

By the way, I am the soul of reason, but I am not politically correct
about anything. I make it a point NOT to be politically correct. You
should try it sometime yourself.


ibid

Jeff,

As you said, we are basically in agreement. In effect you are
preachin' to the choir. Much of what you have said here, I have said
as well. I needn't reiterate here. I'm sure you've read some of my
thoughts about Trolls and about Ed as well.

Jim

Jeff Grippe wrote:
I think we are basically in agreement.

Since Ed doesn't fight fairly, however, I have chosen not to fight with him
at all. I think that if nobody fought with him at all, his fighting would
diminish. He is very good at pushing people's buttons, however, so it is
likely that there will always be someone to fight with him.

Would we be better off without him? Well maybe but the essence of
unmoderated news groups is that anyone with a computer can post to them.

Some people have expressed the idea that since there is so much talk about
and by Ed on topics unrelated to recumbent cycling, that the group isn't
worth reading.

Anyone who chooses to can do the following:
1. post something on-topic (unlike the nonsense that I'm posting now)
2. filter out most of the off topic stuff

I understand the frustration that many feel with the overbearing behavior
and pontification that is Ed but it is my belief that the best way to
minimize it is to ignore it. Arguing with him keeps him going. The troll did
nothing to diminish him (and he has done nothing to diminish the troll).
Regardless of what you or I do, Ed will be Ed. This is the reason that I
have been silent. I never stopped reading the group but I knew that there
was nothing I had to add that was of any value.

So my advice to you (not that you asked for any) is to ignore Ed's rants.
Only respond to his on-topic posts and then stay on topic. This group is his
soapbox. Do what you would do with anyone on a soapbox that you don't agree
with. Stop listening. Certainly don't try to reason or argue with someone
you know can't be reasoned with.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...

Jeff Grippe wrote:
Top post, no problem.

Jim,

Just so we get my POV correct, however, the behavior of Ed Gin is
completely
unacceptable. The behavior of ED is simply ED doing what ED does. I have
no
problem with self-expression that I don't happen to agree with.

As many people have pointed out, there are mechanisms available to filter
out ED's posting if that is what you want to do.

I stand by my description of the cause/effect relationship but I also
believe that Ed Gin (or whoever it is) has crossed a line that ED has
not.

Most of the time I have said that it is my opinion that ED is welcome. I
don't feel that way about the ST. There is a line that ST has crossed
that
ED has not.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...
Jeff,

Pardon the top post. I have to agree with virtually all you have had
to say with but a singular exception. If the group has become what Ed
Dolan has made it and the spamming posts are a reaction to what he
created and without him there would be no such postings, that doesn't
account for why I am also the focus and target of these posts
especially since I was if anything an adversary of Dolan's and even
defended Ed Gin when Dolan asserted that Ed Gin's website hosted
pornographic images when it most assuredly did not..

Jim McNamara

Jeff Grippe wrote:
To Ed,

For a long time I have taken the position that you should be welcomed
to
this group. Actually my position has been that everyone should be
welcome. I
don't really think that has changed. However,

It is difficult to imagine that you can not see that group has become
what
you have made of it.

You have taken pride in being the "All Time Poster" in terms of number
of
messages. I think that means that you have left a pretty big stamp on
the
group. jwold, Ed Gin, or whatever his (or her) name is, is a reaction
to
what you have created. Without Ed Dolan there would be no jwold
postings.

While the idea of "Fight Fire With Fire" is a well know cliche, when
you
actually do it, you end up with a bigger fire. If it is fire you want
then
it is fire you've got. But don't pretend that you have nothing to do
with
it.

If the group happens to be composed of mostly liberals then that is
what
the
group is made up of. It really isn't your place to decide what points
of
view are welcome and what points of view are not.

What this group has become is what you, the all time, number one
poster,
has
made it.

I am certain that you will respond to this post as you respond to just
about
everything.

For the record, I have no intention of carrying on a dialog with you
about
the point's I've raised in this posting. It is a pointless exercise as
is
this message itself I suppose. This means that I will not respond to
anything that you answer and I don't think I'll start another thread
since I
don't have anything else to add.

As I always have (and always will), I wish you well.

Jeff


Jeff,

For the most part, you're preachin' to the choir. No arguments here
cconcerning the spamming troll(s) crossing the line and the law for
that matter, including two felony counts. As concerns Dolan, he is
just what and who he is just doing what he takes pleasure in doing, but
contrary to his belief, if you can believe what Ed contends, I dont'
feel that he serves a worthwhile purpose in so doing. He can be rude,
obnoxious, insulting and disruptive and there are times when I feel
ARBR would be a much better place without him, but you already know
that from my posts in the past. Ed's a bright enough and educated
enough guy who could probably be of some benefit if he wasn't so hard
headed in his opinions and so misguided in his objectives. On the
other hand, there is a world of difference between the two Ed's if
indeed Gin is behind any of this nonsense. Dolan's mock threats aren't
to be taken seriously with or without shotgun in hand, but the garbage
that has been spewed by the cowardly spamming troll(s) is insufferable,
inappropriate and condemnable. To his credit, at least Dolan uses his
real name and real email address. He doesn't hide behind a proxy
server and slink on off to a public library to make post for fear of
retaliation or reprisal. What it takes to do what the spaming troll(s)
have shamefully done is a complete and total lack of balls.

Jim McNamara

Ed,

Top posted for your benefit and enjoyment. To the contrary ... I have
had much to say about the content of your posts. Your just too thick
headed to recognize it. Most recently the beer versus win and length
of stay in Europe and waste of of jet fuel nonsense that you were wrong
about in both instances. Lately I've had little to say simply because
there has to be content in order for me to be able to say anything
about it" and your posts are comprised mostly of recycled garbage.
What you consider to be content is just repetitious nonsense. Your
posts are akin to a broken record.

Jim McNamara

Edward Dolan wrote:
"Jeff Grippe" wrote in message
...

ALL TOP POSTERS ARE IDIOTS!

I think we are basically in agreement.

Since Ed doesn't fight fairly, however, I have chosen not to fight with
him at all. I think that if nobody fought with him at all, his fighting
would diminish. He is very good at pushing people's buttons, however, so
it is likely that there will always be someone to fight with him.

That is a very old saw that someone with whom you disagree does not fight
fairly.

Would we be better off without him? Well maybe but the essence of
unmoderated news groups is that anyone with a computer can post to them.

Some people have expressed the idea that since there is so much talk about
and by Ed on topics unrelated to recumbent cycling, that the group isn't
worth reading.

Anyone who chooses to can do the following:
1. post something on-topic (unlike the nonsense that I'm posting now)
2. filter out most of the off topic stuff

I understand the frustration that many feel with the overbearing behavior
and pontification that is Ed but it is my belief that the best way to
minimize it is to ignore it. Arguing with him keeps him going. The troll
did nothing to diminish him (and he has done nothing to diminish the
troll). Regardless of what you or I do, Ed will be Ed. This is the reason
that I have been silent. I never stopped reading the group but I knew that
there was nothing I had to add that was of any value.

It is difficult indeed to make much headway when you are up against a
gigantic intellect such as mine.

So my advice to you (not that you asked for any) is to ignore Ed's rants.
Only respond to his on-topic posts and then stay on topic. This group is
his soapbox. Do what you would do with anyone on a soapbox that you don't
agree with. Stop listening. Certainly don't try to reason or argue with
someone you know can't be reasoned with.

Jim likes to stalk me and never has much to say about any of my content.

By the way, I am the soul of reason, but I am not politically correct about
anything. I make it a point NOT to be politically correct. You should try it
sometime yourself.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

Edward Dolan wrote:
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...

Jeff Grippe wrote:
Top post, no problem.

Jim,

Just so we get my POV correct, however, the behavior of Ed Gin is
completely
unacceptable. The behavior of ED is simply ED doing what ED does. I have
no
problem with self-expression that I don't happen to agree with.

As many people have pointed out, there are mechanisms available to filter
out ED's posting if that is what you want to do.

I stand by my description of the cause/effect relationship but I also
believe that Ed Gin (or whoever it is) has crossed a line that ED has
not.

Most of the time I have said that it is my opinion that ED is welcome. I
don't feel that way about the ST. There is a line that ST has crossed
that
ED has not.

Jeff
"JimmyMac" wrote in message
ps.com...
Jeff,

Pardon the top post. I have to agree with virtually all you have had
to say with but a singular exception. If the group has become what Ed
Dolan has made it and the spamming posts are a reaction to what he
created and without him there would be no such postings, that doesn't
account for why I am also the focus and target of these posts
especially since I was if anything an adversary of Dolan's and even
defended Ed Gin when Dolan asserted that Ed Gin's website hosted
pornographic images when it most assuredly did not..

Jim McNamara

Jeff Grippe wrote:
To Ed,

For a long time I have taken the position that you should be welcomed
to
this group. Actually my position has been that everyone should be
welcome. I
don't really think that has changed. However,

It is difficult to imagine that you can not see that group has become
what
you have made of it.

You have taken pride in being the "All Time Poster" in terms of number
of
messages. I think that means that you have left a pretty big stamp on
the
group. jwold, Ed Gin, or whatever his (or her) name is, is a reaction
to
what you have created. Without Ed Dolan there would be no jwold
postings.

While the idea of "Fight Fire With Fire" is a well know cliche, when
you
actually do it, you end up with a bigger fire. If it is fire you want
then
it is fire you've got. But don't pretend that you have nothing to do
with
it.

If the group happens to be composed of mostly liberals then that is
what
the
group is made up of. It really isn't your place to decide what points
of
view are welcome and what points of view are not.

What this group has become is what you, the all time, number one
poster,
has
made it.

I am certain that you will respond to this post as you respond to just
about
everything.

For the record, I have no intention of carrying on a dialog with you
about
the point's I've raised in this posting. It is a pointless exercise as
is
this message itself I suppose. This means that I will not respond to
anything that you answer and I don't think I'll start another thread
since I
don't have anything else to add.

As I always have (and always will), I wish you well.

Jeff


Jeff,

For the most part, you're preachin' to the choir. No arguments here
cconcerning the spamming troll(s) crossing the line and the law for
that matter, including two felony counts. As concerns Dolan, he is
just what and who he is just doing what he takes pleasure in doing, but
contrary to his belief, if you can believe what Ed contends, I dont'
feel that he serves a worthwhile purpose in so doing. He can be rude,
obnoxious, insulting and disruptive and there are times when I feel
ARBR would be a much better place without him, but you already know
that from my posts in the past. Ed's a bright enough and educated
enough guy who could probably be of some benefit if he wasn't so hard
headed in his opinions and so misguided in his objectives. On the
other hand, there is a world of difference between the two Ed's if
indeed Gin is behind any of this nonsense. Dolan's mock threats aren't
to be taken seriously with or without shotgun in hand, but the garbage
that has been spewed by the cowardly spamming troll(s) is insufferable,
inappropriate and condemnable. To his credit, at least Dolan uses his
real name and real email address. He doesn't hide behind a proxy
server and slink on off to a public library to make post for fear of
retaliation or reprisal. What it takes to do what the spaming troll(s)
have shamefully done is a complete and total lack of balls.

Jim McNamara

Jim, we have got an ally on our side with Jeff Grippe. Would that this
newsgroup had dozens like him.

Ed Gin does not bother me nearly so much as all those cowards who will not
come out into the open and take a stand. Why do Jon Meinecke and Tom Sherman
ALWAYS take a powder when the ST (SPAMMING TROLL) shows up. It is the
fecklessness of ARBR that drives me to distraction.

What Meinecke and Sherman do or don't do is of little concern to me. I
doubt that Jeff would consider himself to be your ally, but he will
have to speak for himself on that account. I don't have any cause of
any consequence here, so I'm not looking for allies ... don't need
any. I for one will never consider you to be my ally nor I to be
yours.

Jim McNamara

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota