Who Has Gone the Distance?

MagillaGorilla wrote:


That's how life works, Carl. It's like all those people who go to church and
prayer to a Sky Daddy are gonna be real disappointed when they die and find
nothing.

How are they going to be disappointed if they're dead?

On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 17:31:31 -0500, MagillaGorilla
wrote:

Most people who go to a doctor and claim asthma
are fat, sedentary people who
can't figure out why they are out of breath when
they walk up a flight of
stairs.

Where I live, kids die from asthma. Pollution plays a big part in
that.

Carl Sundquist wrote:

MagillaGorilla wrote:
Carl Sundquist wrote:

MagillaGorilla wrote:
Carl Sundquist wrote:

Let me ask you something, Carl - do you think this girl has asthma now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsE4qEfEfO4

Magilla

Hahaha.

Here's your litmus test - if asthma does not exist, and even if it
existed purely as a means for big pharma to draw money out of your
pocket, why do insurance companies pay for the treatment of asthma?

This is a good question, Carl. Did everyone hear the question? Let me
repeat it in case the people in the back row didn't hear it. /*Carl
wants to know why insurance companies would pay for a treatment for
asthma, if it's supposedly not a real ailment, as I asseverate. */

This is a good question, Carl.

Treating people for asthma consists of writing them a 'script' for a
cheap inhaler. Those inhalers are sold to doctors by buxom
ex-cheerleaders who prey upon male doctors' sexual proclivities at the
expense of their medical judgment and best interests of their
patients. The patient is nothing but a prop in the play of the
doctor-pharma relationship. Insurance companies pay this without
protest because they love a cheap, finite, turnkey treatment plan that
is completely resolved by Rx and does not result in expensive, long-term
diagnostics or treatments. They also realize it's cheaper to treat it
that way than to actually treat the true cause of asthma, which would
entail undergoing years of psychoanalysis.


Magilla

references:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/28/business/28cheer.html

The drug companies profit margin on the "cheap inhalers" is puny because
the patent has expired, so small, category 3 equivalent drug companies
(who do not hire cheerleaders) manufacture them. Big Pharma wants you to
buy The Latest And Greatest and that's where the cheerleaders come in. A
quick Google check shows an internet pharmacy selling 10mg Singulair
goes for roughly $41 for 30 pills. Compare that to a generic albuterol
inhaler goes for $15, good for 200 doses, $9 if you buy 6 inhalers at a
time.

I'd bet an MRI could accurately determine restricted airways. But why
should insurance pay for that when 99+% of the people who go to the
doctor for asthma symptoms have no ulterior motive and a spirometer can
indicate the same thing? Where are the statistics showing there are
enough people abusing asthma drugs for the insurance companies to even
consider encouraging doctors to write scripts instead of psychoanalysis?
Where is the outcry from the psychologists?
Psychologists have ADHD, which the allopathic equivalent of asthma.

Most people who go to a doctor and claim asthma are fat, sedentary people who
can't figure out why they are out of breath when they walk up a flight of
stairs. The doctor just wants them out of his office so he can get over to
the marina to take his boat out.

That's how life works, Carl. It's like all those people who go to church and
prayer to a Sky Daddy are gonna be real disappointed when they die and find
nothing.


Magilla

Your analysis still doesn't explain why insurance companies would be
willing to pay for unneccessary drugs. Remember, there are many
insurance plans that split coverage of actual care and meds between
different companies, like Express Scripts. They have nothing to gain by
the doctor scribbling some scripts and shoving the patient out the door.

Insurance companies don't give a ****? Yeah, that's my answer.

Magilla


That's it? I haven't even gotten to my point yet.

I think you answered your own question, Carl. Generic drug companies have made the
price of asthma doping products so low, that the insurance companies view it as a
cost of doing business.

Magilla

John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:

On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 17:31:31 -0500, MagillaGorilla
wrote:

Most people who go to a doctor and claim asthma
are fat, sedentary people who
can't figure out why they are out of breath when
they walk up a flight of
stairs.

Where I live, kids die from asthma. Pollution plays a big part in
that.

You won't find any death certificate from the coroner's office in New
York City that says a single child died of asthma.

Magilla

Howard Kveck wrote:

In article ,
MagillaGorilla wrote:

wrote:

On Nov 29, 2:06 pm, MagillaGorilla wrote:


Where are today's rock stars like Van Halen, Pink Floyd, or U2?


They decided to be like the Ramones, the New York Dolls, and the
Velvet Underground instead...
That's like deciding to be like Cipollini instead of Zabel...



Have you ever been to a real rock concert in a major arena like Madison
Square Garden or the Spectrum? Well, they don't make groups like that
anymore. In fact, the major reason why all these 80's bands continue to
tour into their 50's and 60's is because there is simply no competition
to displace them.

Well, one reason those bands continue to tour is because the old farts who liked
'em in their heyday are still willing to cough up the ducats to see 'em. Sadly, many
of those people never moved on, musically - they still listen to the same 25 songs
they liked when they were in high school.

There will never be an era like the heavy metal era. That was real
sound. Now, all you got are bubblegum Disney kids dancing on stage to
some choreographed set and clapping their hands like some kind of
Village People reunion.

Do you know what it was like to see Ozzy open up with War Pigs? Crazy
**** man.

I've seen way heavier. Just sayin'.

When I see Justin Timberlake on stage, it makes me want to go out and
sight my scope in on my 30-06. The people selling records today are
entertainers, not musicians - that's the problem. They have session
musicians write the songs, and then all they do is come in and memorize
some lyrics. They re-package that to the tweens and that's all it is -
fluff.

That's nothing new. It's been going on for decades. Most of the great soul, Stax
and Motown stuff was written by a small group of songwriters and producers, as was a
lot of the mid-sixties rock. The same groups of studio musicians are playing on tons
of the older stuff - the Funk Brothers, Steve Cropper's crew and LA's Wrecking Crew,
among others. And lots of songs were written by the people employed by the Brill
Building group. Think about all those girl groups and guys like Frankie Avalon - it's
not all that different in concept than the new generation of producer-driven music. I
readily acknowledge that stuff like B Spears, Timberlake, etc. doesn't come close to
comparing to the older stuff, at least the cream of the crop.

When Geddy Lee starts pounding on the steel, you can't compare that to
the nonsense that goes on in today's "concerts."

Oy - Rush. That's super...

--
tanx,
Howard

Caught playing safe
It's a bored game

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Name a single major rock group that has come into existence in the past 10 years. In
the 1970's and 80's there were dozens. See my point?


Thanks,

Magilla

Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In article ,
Howard Kveck wrote:

In article ,
MagillaGorilla wrote:

Ted van de Weteringe wrote:

Ryan Cousineau schreef:
Fred Fredburger wrote:
The great thing about Usenet is that you haven't lost if you don't know
you've lost.

The only way to win is not to play.

Very good, Joshua.

I'd break out the Curel for some Ally Sheedy.

Watching Short Circuit 2 should cure that urge.

http://images.teamsugar.com/files/us.../bclubpss1.jpg

Hm. Ally Sheedy or Molly Ringwald?

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

That's a great question. Personally, I'd go for Molly Ringwald, but Ally was
lookin' good in St. Elmo's Fire.

Magilla

wrote:

On Nov 30, 3:36 am, MagillaGorilla wrote:
wrote:
On Nov 29, 2:06 pm, MagillaGorilla wrote:

Where are today's rock stars like Van Halen, Pink Floyd, or U2?

They decided to be like the Ramones, the New York Dolls, and the
Velvet Underground instead...
That's like deciding to be like Cipollini instead of Zabel...

Have you ever been to a real rock concert in a major arena like Madison
Square Garden or the Spectrum? Well, they don't make groups like that
anymore. In fact, the major reason why all these 80's bands continue to
tour into their 50's and 60's is because there is simply no competition
to displace them.

There will never be an era like the heavy metal era. That was real
sound. Now, all you got are bubblegum Disney kids dancing on stage to
some choreographed set and clapping their hands like some kind of
Village People reunion.

Do you know what it was like to see Ozzy open up with War Pigs? Crazy
**** man.

When I see Justin Timberlake on stage, it makes me want to go out and
sight my scope in on my 30-06. The people selling records today are
entertainers, not musicians - that's the problem. They have session
musicians write the songs, and then all they do is come in and memorize
some lyrics. They re-package that to the tweens and that's all it is -
fluff.

When Geddy Lee starts pounding on the steel, you can't compare that to
the nonsense that goes on in today's "concerts."

Get the **** off my lawn you son-of-a-bitch kids before I call the cops.

Magilla

Now why would I want spend any time at all surrounded by thirty
thousand White Castle employees all flicking their little bics to Dust
in the Stairway to Free Bird when I could go see the Minutemen open
for Black Flag at CBs.
As for those dweeby mulletheads on stage, Iggy would have stuffed them
in a beer can before breakfast - and he still can, now that they're
all balding fatty masters of lard rock.

I respect your point of view.

Magilla

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

Correct...there is actually no such thing as asthma. Elite athletes
define asthma as when their lungs burn towards the end of a 120 mile
Pro Tour road race when they're in the break. If they get anything
but first place in the sprint, they call the lung burn they experience
int he sprint "asthma." In fact, so does the winner(Allesandro
Potato).They then go to a doctor and get him or her to rubber stamp
it. That's how 50% of the Euro pros become "asthmatics." There's
nothing else involved other than a declaration from the athlete,
which is followed immediately by a lifelong prescription from their
dealer doctor.

Magilla

Asthma isn't "lung burn." Anybody can, and likely will, experience
"lung burn" after a brutal effort. You get over it shortly, and it
doesn't have to have any lingering effects down the road. That's very
different from the person who, if it's a bit cool outside, find that
their lungs don't work too well and, while everyone else is yakking
away on the climb, the person suffering from what is commonly referred
to as "exercise induced asthma" has lungs that sound like a steam
engine, scavenging the air for every atom of oxygen that can be found.
It's constant, in that it's always there, completely repeatable, not
dependent upon having had a killer workout the day before or whatever.

That's just one example of what some might consider a legit case of
asthma. It's not acute in that it doesn't bring your effort to a halt;
you can continue to ride, and a sustained hard effort doesn't make it
worse. But the effect is very real, and it's pretty darned easy to
spot (ok, hear) those afflicted, and not many would feel that such a
person should have to ride like that if they could be helped.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

Like I said, asthma doesn't exist. People do define lung burn as asthma
- especially pro cyclists. How else can you explain Pro Tour level
riders who claim to have clinical asthma at a rate of 50%? Do you
really think they would be making $890,000/year and have 1,756 UCI
points if they truly had a serious breathing problem?

Thanks,

Magilla

"Carl Sundquist" wrote in message
news

That's why I said it occurs primarily in the spring season. I am also
affected by it in cold weather, too.

That cold weather breathing problem is not the same thing. If I understand
it correctly, Asthma is identified because it gives a problem EXHALING
whereas the stuff you have gives you problems inhaling I believe.

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Carl Sundquist" wrote in message
...
MagillaGorilla wrote:

Treating people for asthma consists of writing them a 'script' for a
cheap inhaler. Those inhalers are sold to doctors by buxom
ex-cheerleaders who prey upon male doctors' sexual proclivities at the
expense of their medical judgment and best interests of their patients.

The drug companies profit margin on the "cheap inhalers" is puny because
the patent has expired, so small, category 3 equivalent drug companies
(who do not hire cheerleaders) manufacture them. Big Pharma wants you to
buy The Latest And Greatest and that's where the cheerleaders come in. A
quick Google check shows an internet pharmacy selling 10mg Singulair goes
for roughly $41 for 30 pills. Compare that to a generic albuterol inhaler
goes for $15, good for 200 doses, $9 if you buy 6 inhalers at a time.

Carl, you're arguing with an idiot that doesn't believe that Asthma is a
real disease.

While he's correct that you don't have "real" Asthma, you indeed have
asthmatic symptoms caused by hay fever (allergies) and these can be as bad
or even worse than "real" Asthma upon occasion.

Asthma first presents in childhood.

Asthma is a chronic lung disease that inflames and narrows
the airways. Asthma causes recurring periods of wheezing
(a whistling sound when you breathe), chest tightness,
shortness of breath, and coughing. The coughing often
occurs at night or early in the morning.
People who have asthma have inflamed airways. This makes
the airways swollen and very sensitive. They tend to react
strongly to certain substances that are breathed in.

When the airways react, the muscles around them tighten.
This causes the airways to narrow, and less air flows to
your lungs. The swelling also can worsen, making the
airways even narrower. Cells in the airways may make more
mucus than normal. This chain reaction can result in
asthma symptoms. Symptoms can happen each time the airways
are irritated.

Sometimes symptoms are mild and go away on their own or
after minimal treatment with an asthma medicine. At other
times, symptoms continue to get worse. When symptoms get
more intense and/or additional symptoms appear, this is
an asthma attack. Asthma attacks also are called flareups
or exacerbations.

--
Michael Press