how long does a broken collarbone take ?

MagillaGorilla wrote:
I wonder if Haldeman makes everyone watch a slideshow and film of his RAAM win
like the Hamster shows of the Gavia Pass before the campers set out on a fun
ride.

What do you mean, "like"? Hamster did not win on the Gavia.

Susan Walker wrote:

MagillaGorilla wrote:
I wonder if Haldeman makes everyone watch a slideshow and film of his RAAM win
like the Hamster shows of the Gavia Pass before the campers set out on a fun
ride.

What do you mean, "like"? Hamster did not win on the Gavia.

You know what I mean, spleen.

Magilla

On Mar 26, 4:44*pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article ,


Tell us more about wattage.


dumbass,

if you take a bunch of avg. sized healthy twenty something guys and
they raced and trained the way amateurs do, you would find most have a
threshold around 300 ish watts and that number will tend to stablize
after 1-2 years of racing.

given what an avg. sized amateur would weigh (say 70-80 kg) you can
see 4W/kg is attainable. that would make one somewhat strong and a cat
2. a lot of people will be able to gt to this level.

a few of the guys who are stronger or smaller might get to 5W/kg.
those would be your local strongmen, but a protour rider would have to
sustain about 6W/kg. a cat 2 would have to increase their W/kg by 50%
to get to that level. a person that has some years of racing just
won't see that kind of gain.

anyone who's raced for sometime knows that you plateau after a few
years, and all conditioning you do might make you a bit better than
other people just like you, but that's it.

MagillaGorilla wrote:
Being a pro is about genetics.

Paging fat steve.

On Mar 27, 1:28*am, Amit Ghosh wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:44*pm, Michael Press wrote:

In article ,

Tell us more about wattage.

dumbass,

if you take a bunch of avg. sized healthy twenty something guys and
they raced and trained the way amateurs do, you would find most have a
threshold around 300 ish watts and that number will tend to stablize
after 1-2 years of racing.

given what an avg. sized amateur would weigh (say 70-80 kg) you can
see 4W/kg is attainable. that would make one somewhat strong and a cat
2. a lot of people will be able to gt to this level.

a few of the guys who are stronger or smaller might get to 5W/kg.
those would be your local strongmen, but a protour rider would have to
sustain about 6W/kg. a cat 2 would have to increase their W/kg by 50%
to get to that level. a person that has some years of racing just
won't see that kind of gain.

anyone who's raced for sometime knows that you plateau after a few
years, and all conditioning you do might make you a bit better than
other people just like you, but that's it.

interesting. any info or estimates on lances wattage per kg ? or his
max sustainable wattage ?

raamman wrote:
interesting. any info or estimates on lances wattage per kg ? or his max
sustainable wattage ?

Ask Ferrari.

On Mar 25, 5:10*pm, wrote:
On 25 Mar 2009 20:41:55 GMT, William Asher


If the reason someone races industrial park crits is because he or she
likes the competition at an industrial yard crit, the whole 'metaphor'
falls apart. I've watched people show up for the Wednesday training
series with no other intent than to be there the next week. Year after
year. They didn't even race at the weekend crits. No delusions.

dumbass,

let me elaborate. i think cycling is a great hobby, and amateur racing
is great as a form of aerobic golf, but i also often see and
overwhelming selfishness and/or self absorption.

a few gifted riders will be pros, the rest have to realize that
cycling is and always will be only a hobby.

i have to question why someone like liz hatch wants to be a "pro". if
she likes riding and racing, she can still do that. it can't be the
money, a person like her could do dozens of jobs (personal trainer,
bartender) and make more than a domestic female pro. then it must be
the social validation a person gets from being a good athlete.

that's a big reason riders spend tons of money and time trying to get
better. that's okay; it's their time and money (and naturally everyone
wants to be better), but a lot of those resources could be better
spent to improve their own experience - since that is supposedly why
people race, for the fun and excitement of racing.

take for instance the master fattie in the wind tunnel (at $800 an hr
or whatever). the money and time he puts into that he could put into a
TT series. that would probably help his performance more than the
stupid tunnel and it would also benefit other riders and improve the
cycling scene in his area. to top it off, the series might even make
money.

i might ask a rider if he wants to help me bang in stakes for two
hours and he'll say he's too busy even though he's out on the bike 8
hrs every weekend.

in my city the municipality is serving every niche: building soccer
facilities, cricket pitches, etc. When i'm scouting training routes
and possible race courses on googlemaps I'm struck by the amount of
land that's put aside for golf courses. somehow golfers have managed
to appropriate immense amounts of resources for their stupid hobby,
yet it's impossible to find a suitable 15 km TT circuit or a 2km
course for an industrial park crit that's within 30 minutes of the
downtown core.

if golf was like cycling, golfers would practice 20 hrs a week in
their backyards, basements and in city parkettes and then drive 3
hours out of town to that one golf course a few times a year to play a
round with all the other hundreds of golfers.

as a rider you would think that it would be smart to lobby cities, the
police etc. to make it easier to hold races, or perhaps build a
training area, but most amateurs are too busy doing junk miles (and
just being tired all the time) and spending money on stupid **** in
the hopes they'll be faster than the other schmoe bags on sunday. it
seems like a lot of effort for that little ego boost. i would rather
have more and interesting events to ride in than some stupid electric
shifters or another 12 watts of threshold power.

In article
,
Amit Ghosh wrote:

On Mar 25, 5:10*pm, wrote:
On 25 Mar 2009 20:41:55 GMT, William Asher


If the reason someone races industrial park crits is because he or she
likes the competition at an industrial yard crit, the whole 'metaphor'
falls apart. I've watched people show up for the Wednesday training
series with no other intent than to be there the next week. Year after
year. They didn't even race at the weekend crits. No delusions.

dumbass,

Where to start...

let me elaborate. i think cycling is a great hobby, and amateur racing
is great as a form of aerobic golf, but i also often see and
overwhelming selfishness and/or self absorption.

a few gifted riders will be pros, the rest have to realize that
cycling is and always will be only a hobby.

i have to question why someone like liz hatch wants to be a "pro". if
she likes riding and racing, she can still do that. it can't be the
money, a person like her could do dozens of jobs (personal trainer,
bartender) and make more than a domestic female pro. then it must be
the social validation a person gets from being a good athlete.

I agree that being a pro cyclist is a miserable gig for the most part.
But aside from the fact that certain types of people would just enjoy
being a pro cyclist more than they'd enjoy being a bartender, if you're
going to end up as a personal trainer, for example, spending a couple of
years becoming "former professional cyclist" is both practical training
for that vocation, and also an excellent way to enter your second career
with a pre-built reputation. Don't underestimate the number of aspiring
and dilettante personal trainers, versus the few serious ones and fewer
Carmichael-grade superstars.

My brother-in-law was an aspiring pro hockey player. He spent years
living the 12k (or less) dream, culminating in a season with the Austin
Ice Bats (AA hockey, more or less).

After he gave that up sometime in his mid-20s, he came home, finished
his degree, and co-founded a hockey training school. He is doing very
well.

Finally, "Liz Hatch, Texas barmaid" is way less likely to be in Maxim.

that's a big reason riders spend tons of money and time trying to get
better. that's okay; it's their time and money (and naturally everyone
wants to be better), but a lot of those resources could be better
spent to improve their own experience - since that is supposedly why
people race, for the fun and excitement of racing.

take for instance the master fattie in the wind tunnel (at $800 an hr
or whatever). the money and time he puts into that he could put into a
TT series. that would probably help his performance more than the
stupid tunnel and it would also benefit other riders and improve the
cycling scene in his area. to top it off, the series might even make
money.

i might ask a rider if he wants to help me bang in stakes for two
hours and he'll say he's too busy even though he's out on the bike 8
hrs every weekend.

in my city the municipality is serving every niche: building soccer
facilities, cricket pitches, etc. When i'm scouting training routes
and possible race courses on googlemaps I'm struck by the amount of
land that's put aside for golf courses. somehow golfers have managed
to appropriate immense amounts of resources for their stupid hobby,
yet it's impossible to find a suitable 15 km TT circuit or a 2km
course for an industrial park crit that's within 30 minutes of the
downtown core.

Dumbass: I don't know how it is in your area, but here in Lotusland
public courses are outnumbered by private ones, and usage rates are
high. As are green fees.

if golf was like cycling, golfers would practice 20 hrs a week in
their backyards, basements and in city parkettes and then drive 3
hours out of town to that one golf course a few times a year to play a
round with all the other hundreds of golfers.

Competitive cycling or just pedaling? We here in rbr seem to think that
only racing defines a serious roadie, while I know plenty of people who
own and ride road bikes, but don't race. Charity rides? sure. The ratio
must be similar to that between golfers and golfers who play in
tournaments.

In short, racing doesn't define the sport. If there were as many bike
racers as there were golfers, private race circuits would be
economically viable.

as a rider you would think that it would be smart to lobby cities, the
police etc. to make it easier to hold races, or perhaps build a
training area, but most amateurs are too busy doing junk miles (and
just being tired all the time) and spending money on stupid **** in
the hopes they'll be faster than the other schmoe bags on sunday. it
seems like a lot of effort for that little ego boost. i would rather
have more and interesting events to ride in than some stupid electric
shifters or another 12 watts of threshold power.

Most amateurs can already train on the roads as built. It would be great
to have a dedicated "bike park" (which in practice, would look a lot
like Mosport except you'd want to ensure you had a crit-sized circuit,
and a TT course of some sort.

As for more events, the secret is to build up the competitor numbers. If
they exist, then everything else will fall into place. Vancouver has
about 200-300 competitive cyclists (~1000 licencees across the
province), enough to sustain two midweek crit series and a fair number
of road events.

200-300 golfers wouldn't be enough to run a single golf course. Which is
fine, because there are probably 200-300 golfers per square mile in
parts of Vancouver.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

Ryan Cousineau wrote:
200-300 golfers wouldn't be enough to run a single golf course. Which is
fine, because there are probably 200-300 golfers per square mile in parts
of Vancouver.

That's terrible. Just imagine if there were that many triathletes.

In article ,
Donald Munro wrote:

Ryan Cousineau wrote:
200-300 golfers wouldn't be enough to run a single golf course. Which is
fine, because there are probably 200-300 golfers per square mile in parts
of Vancouver.

That's terrible. Just imagine if there were that many triathletes.

It's what drives my Night Terrors.

Hilarious but true: my club runs a pretty big Spring Series of training
races. These are low-key, but we have a lot of problems with yellow-line
violations, so this year me and several other club members were
designated "in-race commissaires" for the purpose of yellow-line
violations.

Last weekend we had a sketch-pilot who found pack riding intolerable,
and on the last lap tried to attack on the wrong side of the yellow
line, making about 10 positions or something.

Yeah, he was a triathlete.

I really am glad some of these guys are trying out road racing. But even
when you assume all the "triathletes can't ride bikes" tropes are true,
they STILL surprise you.

I think it's the dangerous combo of more wattage than pack experience.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."