Rubber cement question

AE6KS

during a prior discussion was proven as wriiiten here ...the small tube eg Bell Walmart sets up inside the tube.

Weldwood does not set up inside the small bottle. Add gasket..AAA

gasketing tubes involves clean threads. the tube is rolled up correctly from bottom as pressed there for extruding contents...from the beginning. stupid.no slop.

so...for the 7th time ... squeeze tube bottom extruding dome of contents above nozzle....cap with gasket ...continue very slowly pressuring tube bottom...twist cap on over gasket.

result is no air and sealed tube.

no reason to thrash around abt this. this is SOP.

REI sells small bottles for backpacking food or med use.

there air evacuating equipped bottles for lab work but there's a pump ....

if you are self plaged by myriad glue problems go into NAPA n buy a small can of NAPA rubber cement. High solvent content for 'shop' conditions. store in basement or root cellar....gasketed... protecting roots.

On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 9:27:59 AM UTC-4, wrote:
AE6KS

during a prior discussion was proven as wriiiten here ...the small tube eg Bell Walmart sets up inside the tube.

Weldwood does not set up inside the small bottle. Add gasket..AAA

gasketing tubes involves clean threads. the tube is rolled up correctly from bottom as pressed there for extruding contents...from the beginning. stupid.no slop.

so...for the 7th time ... squeeze tube bottom extruding dome of contents above nozzle....cap with gasket ...continue very slowly pressuring tube bottom...twist cap on over gasket.

result is no air and sealed tube.

no reason to thrash around abt this. this is SOP.

REI sells small bottles for backpacking food or med use.

there air evacuating equipped bottles for lab work but there's a pump ....

if you are self plaged by myriad glue problems go into NAPA n buy a small can of NAPA rubber cement. High solvent content for 'shop' conditions. store in basement or root cellar....gasketed... protecting roots.

over the Coast Range n across the Grand Desierto

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1Q...hoOuDX1P0ZvYHb

if the photo link doesn't work please advise.

On 6/20/2017 9:27 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 5:58:34 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 02:12:04 +0000 (UTC), David Scheidt
wrote:

In the case of the little tubes, the problem is not always that the
solvent has evaporated. The contents of tube can vulcanize itself
into a hard mass, even in the presence of solvent. That's
particularly likely where it's hot, and the vulcanizing fluid is kept
somehwerer like a seat wedge, where it's well heated.

I keep both automobile and bicycle tire patch kits in my car. It gets
rather warm in the car at times. Both kits include those little tubes
of rubber cement. At best, they last a few months. I tore apart one
that was in my rather hot car for over one year. It was almost
completely empty with only a tiny rubber-like blob at the bottom of
the tube. It had never been opened and was not punctured or leaking.
At first, I thought it might be defective from the factory, but then I
found another tube with the same problem. I've gone no further with
this investigation. If it's heat that's causing the cement to harden,
then storing it in a car or riding around with it on a bicycle, are
not going to work.

Except for it being banned in California for using MEK and toluene as
the solvent, I wonder if this stuff might work better?
https://www.ellsworth.com/products/by-manufacturer/3m/adhesives/solvent-based/3m-scotch-weld-1300-neoprene-rubber-and-gasket-adhesive-yellow-5-oz-tube/
Bicycle tires are mostly butyl rubber.

What ever the solvent is, that is the carrier, doesn't "dry up". Eventually it leaks out through the crimped end of the tube.

I wondered about that, and whether some more enthusiastic crimping would
help, using a bench vise.

But to me the problem seems small. Patch kits are cheap.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 8:29:00 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/20/2017 9:27 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 5:58:34 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 02:12:04 +0000 (UTC), David Scheidt
wrote:

In the case of the little tubes, the problem is not always that the
solvent has evaporated. The contents of tube can vulcanize itself
into a hard mass, even in the presence of solvent. That's
particularly likely where it's hot, and the vulcanizing fluid is kept
somehwerer like a seat wedge, where it's well heated.

I keep both automobile and bicycle tire patch kits in my car. It gets
rather warm in the car at times. Both kits include those little tubes
of rubber cement. At best, they last a few months. I tore apart one
that was in my rather hot car for over one year. It was almost
completely empty with only a tiny rubber-like blob at the bottom of
the tube. It had never been opened and was not punctured or leaking.
At first, I thought it might be defective from the factory, but then I
found another tube with the same problem. I've gone no further with
this investigation. If it's heat that's causing the cement to harden,
then storing it in a car or riding around with it on a bicycle, are
not going to work.

Except for it being banned in California for using MEK and toluene as
the solvent, I wonder if this stuff might work better?
https://www.ellsworth.com/products/by-manufacturer/3m/adhesives/solvent-based/3m-scotch-weld-1300-neoprene-rubber-and-gasket-adhesive-yellow-5-oz-tube/
Bicycle tires are mostly butyl rubber.

What ever the solvent is, that is the carrier, doesn't "dry up". Eventually it leaks out through the crimped end of the tube.

I wondered about that, and whether some more enthusiastic crimping would
help, using a bench vise.

But to me the problem seems small. Patch kits are cheap.


--
- Frank Krygowski

As I said, I did investigate and use glueless patches and carefully used they do work. Since there is no solvent to dry up I assume they last a long time in a seat pack.

Using the glueless patch I did not inflate the tube outside of the tire to check for additional holes. I installed the tube and inflated it inside the tire so that the pressure of the tube against the tire aided in any additional pressure required to assure a good seal.

On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 06:32:42 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1Q...hoOuDX1P0ZvYHb
if the photo link doesn't work please advise.

Google
404. That’s an error.
The requested URL was not found on this server. That’s all we know.

You've been advised.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Frank Krygowski wrote:
:On 6/20/2017 9:27 AM, wrote:
: On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 5:58:34 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
: On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 02:12:04 +0000 (UTC), David Scheidt
: wrote:
:
: In the case of the little tubes, the problem is not always that the
: solvent has evaporated. The contents of tube can vulcanize itself
: into a hard mass, even in the presence of solvent. That's
: particularly likely where it's hot, and the vulcanizing fluid is kept
: somehwerer like a seat wedge, where it's well heated.
:
: I keep both automobile and bicycle tire patch kits in my car. It gets
: rather warm in the car at times. Both kits include those little tubes
: of rubber cement. At best, they last a few months. I tore apart one
: that was in my rather hot car for over one year. It was almost
: completely empty with only a tiny rubber-like blob at the bottom of
: the tube. It had never been opened and was not punctured or leaking.
: At first, I thought it might be defective from the factory, but then I
: found another tube with the same problem. I've gone no further with
: this investigation. If it's heat that's causing the cement to harden,
: then storing it in a car or riding around with it on a bicycle, are
: not going to work.
:
: Except for it being banned in California for using MEK and toluene as
: the solvent, I wonder if this stuff might work better?
: https://www.ellsworth.com/products/by-manufacturer/3m/adhesives/solvent-based/3m-scotch-weld-1300-neoprene-rubber-and-gasket-adhesive-yellow-5-oz-tube/
: Bicycle tires are mostly butyl rubber.
:
: What ever the solvent is, that is the carrier, doesn't "dry up". Eventually it leaks out through the crimped end of the tube.

:I wondered about that, and whether some more enthusiastic crimping would
:help, using a bench vise.

When the tubes were made of lead foil, it might have. They're now
some sort of laminated plastic material that's closed by
(heat|ultrasonic) welding.

:But to me the problem seems small. Patch kits are cheap.

they're cheap, but when you need one, it would be nice if the one in
your bag worked.

--
sig 118

On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 1:01:57 PM UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 06:32:42 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1Q...hoOuDX1P0ZvYHb
if the photo link doesn't work please advise.

Google
404. That’s an error.
The requested URL was not found on this server. That’s all we know.

You've been advised.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

the SHARE control isn't up front

thanks

On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 1:57:55 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 1:01:57 PM UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jun 2017 06:32:42 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1Q...hoOuDX1P0ZvYHb
if the photo link doesn't work please advise.

Google
404. That’s an error.
The requested URL was not found on this server. That’s all we know.

You've been advised.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

the SHARE control isn't up front

thanks

https://goo.gl/photos/CeE92RSjNNu72zSP9

On 2017-06-19 18:17, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 19 Jun 2017 12:47:56 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Question: Is there some sort of cheap/free micro container
that could be used to fill some into and carry along? Something where it
lasts a longer time than the tiny tubes but where it's ok that the goop
in this little container is for use at one event only.

Aluminum pill bottles perhaps?
https://www.google.com/search?q=aluminum+pill+bottles&tbm=isch
I have a similar problem with Nitrostat pill evaporating into
uselessness. I drilled one and inserted a tire stem and valve. It
holds pressure quite nicely. The idea is to pressurize the pill
bottle to something higher than the vapor pressure for nitroglycerin
so that it will not voltatize. I suspect the same can be done for
rubber cement by pressuring with something that is not very reactive,
such as CO2, N2, or perhaps propane. Some kind of anti-sieze or
grease might be needed to keep the threads from being glued in place.
The bottle I have here has only 3 threads and is rather loose, but has
a nice o-ring to seal the cap.

Disclaimer: I haven't tried this with rubber cement.


Good idea. It looks like they have an o-ring to seal. I could try to
fill one to the brim. From beer brewing I'd theoretically have access to
the CO2 that escapes the fermenter but pressurizing with that would be a
challenge. I'd have to suck the CO2 into an old bicycle pump and then
somehow fill that in.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-06-19 19:12, David Scheidt wrote:
Mark J. wrote:
:On 6/19/2017 12:47 PM, Joerg wrote:
: We all know that the stuff in those tiny rubber cement tubes dries out
: over time, sometimes even when unopened. So after advice here in the
: group I bought a large can a while ago.
:
: https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon....1ZPISh9s3L.jpg
:
: Works well.

:So did my can (Rema brand in my case) when I bought it years ago. For a
:while. Then the can dried out, even though tightly screwed shut (with a
:channel-lock, as I recall).

The bottle in my file cabinet at work has lasted at least five years,
probably six. I simply put the lid on when I'm not using it. It's an
american brand, purchased at an auto parts store. Maybe americans
understand bottle sealing better than the germans.

In the case of the little tubes, the problem is not always that the
solvent has evaporated. The contents of tube can vulcanize itself
into a hard mass, even in the presence of solvent. That's
particularly likely where it's hot, and the vulcanizing fluid is kept
somehwerer ike a seat wedge, where it's well heated.


Heat is probably the biggest issue. The smaller size panniers I have on
the road bike and the MTB only come in black and I usually start my
longer rides shortly before lunch time, meaning in the glistening sun.
At some point everything in the panniers bakes no matter how well insulated.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/