A new way to confuse motorists.

Wrong way, on the sidewalk, after dark, *red blinkie on the front.*

seriously.

in their defense, at least I did see them (yes, two of them together...)

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
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On Dec 14, 7:40 pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
Wrong way, on the sidewalk, after dark, *red blinkie on the front.*


There is no wrong way on the sidewalk.

Hi,

Dan O wrote:
On Dec 14, 7:40 pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
Wrong way, on the sidewalk, after dark, *red blinkie on the front.*

Ugh. Then talk about "cycling is so dangerous", I've had enough of those...

There is no wrong way on the sidewalk.

Actually, where I live legislation counts cyclists as vehicle and
driver, the same state given to cars or trucks. Which boils down to
using the right side of the street, even if you use the sidewalk. As
many sidewalks are marked as bike lane, you have to use the right side,
otherwise it counts legally just like driving your car on the left.

Apart from that, what the OP described is the reason why cycling is
dangerous - the guys are cycling in a toy-like manner (just like
children who are required to cycle on the sidewalk here), which is
actually far more dangerous than cycling on the street or (at least) on
the right side of the sidewalk - where motorists expect a bike...
Actually these guys, who act like they didn't have a driving license,
will be the worst car drivers and will loudly talk about the dangers of
cycling...

Ciao..

On Dec 15, 12:26 am, Bernhard Agthe wrote:
Hi,

Dan O wrote:
On Dec 14, 7:40 pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
Wrong way, on the sidewalk, after dark, *red blinkie on the front.*

Ugh. Then talk about "cycling is so dangerous", I've had enough of those...

There is no wrong way on the sidewalk.

Actually, where I live legislation counts cyclists as vehicle and
driver, the same state given to cars or trucks. Which boils down to
using the right side of the street, even if you use the sidewalk. As
many sidewalks are marked as bike lane, you have to use the right side,
otherwise it counts legally just like driving your car on the left.


Actually, where the OP reportedly lives, the law reads:

"A person riding a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility
device, motorized skateboard or scooter, motor-driven cycle, or an
electric power-assisted bicycle on a sidewalk, shared-use path, or
across a roadway on a crosswalk, shall have all the rights and duties
of a pedestrian under the same circumstances."

Apart from that, what the OP described is the reason why cycling is
dangerous - the guys are cycling in a toy-like manner (just like
children who are required to cycle on the sidewalk here),...

Acting too grown up all the time is no way to live. I thought people
who ride bikes would know that as well as anyone. People just need to
exercise due care.

... which is
actually far more dangerous than cycling on the street or (at least) on
the right side of the sidewalk - where motorists expect a bike...

Motorists would do better to expect nothing... and anything.

Actually these guys, who act like they didn't have a driving license,
will be the worst car drivers and will loudly talk about the dangers of
cycling...


Sounds awfully judgemental based on very little actual knowledge, and
what kind of car drivers these guys might be is completely irrelevant
anyway.

Ciao..

Hi,

Dan O wrote:
On Dec 15, 12:26 am, Bernhard Agthe wrote:

Actually, where the OP reportedly lives, the law reads:

"A person riding a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility
device, motorized skateboard or scooter, motor-driven cycle, or an
electric power-assisted bicycle on a sidewalk, shared-use path, or
across a roadway on a crosswalk, shall have all the rights and duties
of a pedestrian under the same circumstances."

So in my place this would mean that cycling on the sidewalk is
speed-restricted to pedestrian speeds and you'd be better of pushing
your bike (which the law requires to do on the street)... Actually there
is a petition for a law to forbid cycling right now... People here are
rather fixed on how they think the world should look like - and traffic
is so bad because basically nobody looks what he's doing :-(

Acting too grown up all the time is no way to live. I thought people

Agree.

who ride bikes would know that as well as anyone. People just need to
exercise due care.

Well, I do see the example of not exercising any perceptible care...
Cycling at typical bike speeds at night without lights and on the
sidewalk (right through the hut of a bus station where people are
waiting for the bus) is not due care - at least as I see it regularly...

Motorists would do better to expect nothing... and anything.

Well, as I said, motorists rarely look where they're going (the last one
to almost hit me was watching TV on the GPS screen or whatever) - and
some are so intent on getting to the next red traffic light half a
second earlier that they try to run me over regularly...

Sounds awfully judgemental based on very little actual knowledge, and
what kind of car drivers these guys might be is completely irrelevant
anyway.

Dis-illusioned is what I'd call it - 90% of cyclists and drivers are
careful enough, but the 10% "black sheep" do certainly make up for being
so few...

Well, in my opinion, the concept of car traffic has failed. Badly.
During rush-hours the traffic is so bad that you can call it "standing"
and the speeds experienced on the streets are often too high - on the
other hand, cycle lanes (and there are a lot of them here) are near
impossible to ride on, at least if you're not suicidal. Car drivers
actually play "cop" and actively try to forcy cyclists off the road,
even if there's no cycle path - sometimes not even a sidewalk. Six of
eight cyclists who got run over last year were using cycle paths (and
drove in the right direction).

Cycle education for school kids (I can see them train several times a
year) is a very bad joke at best - they get taught how not to cycle. The
things they are forced to use for training don't fit the least, nor do
the helmets they have to wear, but wearing a helmet and a warning vest
in the park is more important than basic cycling skills...

So that's roughly how many adults cycle - barely able to control their
bikes, but going as fast as possible... Do you wonder about people
complaining they feel unsafe?

Sorry, every time I think it's getting better, I experience some getting
worse :-(((

Ciao

On Dec 16, 12:18*am, Bernhard Agthe wrote:
Hi,

Dan O wrote:
On Dec 15, 12:26 am, Bernhard Agthe wrote:
Actually, where the OP reportedly lives, the law reads:

"A person riding a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility
device, motorized skateboard or scooter, motor-driven cycle, or an
electric power-assisted bicycle on a sidewalk, shared-use path, or
across a roadway on a crosswalk, shall have all the rights and duties
of a pedestrian under the same circumstances."

So in my place this would mean that cycling on the sidewalk is
speed-restricted to pedestrian speeds...

In my area we are more fortunate to have explicit language defining
unsafe operation of a bicycle on the sidewalk. Among others, is this:

"Operates the bicycle at a speed greater than an ordinary walk when
approaching or entering a crosswalk, approaching or crossing a
driveway or crossing a curb cut or pedestrian ramp and a motor vehicle
is approaching the crosswalk, driveway, curb cut or pedestrian ramp.
This paragraph does not require reduced speeds for bicycles at places
on sidewalks or other pedestrian ways other than places where the path
for pedestrians or bicycle traffic approaches or crosses that for
motor vehicle traffic."

... and you'd be better of pushing
your bike (which the law requires to do on the street)... Actually there
is a petition for a law to forbid cycling right now... People here are
rather fixed on how they think the world should look like - and traffic
is so bad because basically nobody looks what he's doing :-(


Holy moly!!! I guess the situation is not so bad here after all.
(One of the tenets I always come back to is, "could be worse" :-)

Acting too grown up all the time is no way to live. *I thought people

Agree.

who ride bikes would know that as well as anyone. *People just need to
exercise due care.

Well, I do see the example of not exercising any perceptible care...
Cycling at typical bike speeds at night without lights and on the
sidewalk (right through the hut of a bus station where people are
waiting for the bus) is not due care - at least as I see it regularly...


Agree.

Motorists would do better to expect nothing... and anything.

Well, as I said, motorists rarely look where they're going (the last one
to almost hit me was watching TV on the GPS screen or whatever) - and
some are so intent on getting to the next red traffic light half a
second earlier that they try to run me over regularly...


Yeah, it's quite an amazing phenomenon: I think drivers see the
bicyclist, immediately regard him as something that doesn't belong and
is in their way, and become fixated on getting past by any means -
whether or not it even makes sense in the context of the traffic
dynamics present.

Sounds awfully judgemental based on very little actual knowledge, and
what kind of car drivers these guys might be is completely irrelevant
anyway.

Dis-illusioned is what I'd call it - 90% of cyclists and drivers are
careful enough, but the 10% "black sheep" do certainly make up for being
so few...


There's a whole spectrum. Plenty of people disapprove of things that
I do. I try to just let go the many transgressions against myself.

Well, in my opinion, the concept of car traffic has failed. Badly.
During rush-hours the traffic is so bad that you can call it "standing"
and the speeds experienced on the streets are often too high - on the
other hand, cycle lanes (and there are a lot of them here) are near
impossible to ride on, at least if you're not suicidal. Car drivers
actually play "cop" and actively try to forcy cyclists off the road,
even if there's no cycle path - sometimes not even a sidewalk. Six of
eight cyclists who got run over last year were using cycle paths (and
drove in the right direction).


In my country, the concept of the car is practically the dominant
culture of society.

Cycle education for school kids (I can see them train several times a
year) is a very bad joke at best - they get taught how not to cycle. The
things they are forced to use for training don't fit the least, nor do
the helmets they have to wear, but wearing a helmet and a warning vest
in the park is more important than basic cycling skills...


There is hope for the future. We must keep doing what we can when we
can. Little things all lend to the total. Kids are people, too.
They have the capacity to think, at least, so that's good.

So that's roughly how many adults cycle - barely able to control their
bikes, but going as fast as possible... Do you wonder about people
complaining they feel unsafe?


I don't know what to say to them. They need to ride more, I think. I
ride a lot in all sorts of conditions, am not afraid to slice-and-dice
heavy traffic like a messenger on a mission, and do not feel
especially at risk (my safety is *mostly* in my hands). But it *is* a
jungle out there - in terms of the attitudes and behaviors encountered
every day.

Sorry, every time I think it's getting better, I experience some getting
worse :-(((


I think that's how it's always been, and always will be. It's the
journey - and the continuing effort to improve - that matters.

Ciao

Best Regards,
Dan

Hi,

Dan O wrote:
In my area we are more fortunate to have explicit language defining
unsafe operation of a bicycle on the sidewalk. Among others, is this:
....

Translated to the city I live near: don't cycle. There's a driveway,
crossing or whatever every few meters - in some areas of town roughly
every 30m. Outside of the city you'll often (not always) find bike paths
on one side of the street, which would be comfortable if...

- there was a safe crossing possible if you're on the other side,
- the bike path wouldn't be *lower* than the street which:
- puts the cyclist into the headlights' beams of oncoming traffict
(meaning you cycle blind at night) and
- according to the number of obviously missing posts at the side of the
street puts the cyclist right in the path of cars that unintentionally
leave the street...

So basically this is not good.

Of course, you can trust Murphy - if there's a considerable stretch of
uphill, there won't be a bike path near, but if you can go downhill
you'll be forced to use a bike path that allows nothing beyond walking
speed - where the uphill bike path would be really welcome and the
downhill one is as stupid as it gets - I easily reach car-compatible
speeds downhill... And trying to maneuver through a series of stupid
corners at that speed is suicidal...

Holy moly!!! I guess the situation is not so bad here after all.
(One of the tenets I always come back to is, "could be worse" :-)

Well, I guess there's worse traffic than here (if you count in cars per
area of street), but I guess there are nowhere as many "dense" people as
there are here...

Yeah, it's quite an amazing phenomenon: I think drivers see the
bicyclist, immediately regard him as something that doesn't belong and
is in their way, and become fixated on getting past by any means -
whether or not it even makes sense in the context of the traffic
dynamics present.

Yup, the "overtaking obligation" - I've been overtaken by drivers in the
middle of a traffic jam - they just stand half a car's length further on
- stupid and dangerous... This usually is the moment when I wish some
kind of electro-shock in the steering wheel ;-)

In my country, the concept of the car is practically the dominant
culture of society.

To cite the Hitchhiker-to-the-galaxy-movie: cars are the predominant
life form on this planet...

Which is sad, because there's so much that would be better(TM) without
cars...

Ciao...