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#2
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Age and Heart Rates
On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 11:22:06 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Your heart rate will increase linearly as long as you're in the aerobic zone. If you go into the anaerobic zone it will only increase a little. At this time the muscles start burning lactate that is stored in the muscles and this is difficult to do for more than half a minute or so. This represents your actual max heart rate. But that is not you healthy heart rate with is 220-age. This practical heart rate has to do with your metabolic heart rate and will be below your true max heart rate. If you are over 50 and operate for any amount of time over 90% of your max metabolic heart rate you are starving the heart muscles of it's very small storage of lactate. That is, your heart is operating in it's anaerobic. Since the older you are the slower you can reload your muscles (and the heart is a muscle) with lactate and the most chance you have of it seizing up. Bicycling is an endurance sport and that means you must always operate within your aerobic zone. If you start breathing harder and when you back off a little it takes awhile for your heart rate and breathing to come back down you are going too hard. If you are in your aerobic zone when you back off your breathing will almost immediately back down as well. |
#3
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Age and Heart Rates
On 2016-12-10 13:13, wrote:
On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 11:22:06 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Your heart rate will increase linearly as long as you're in the aerobic zone. If you go into the anaerobic zone it will only increase a little. At this time the muscles start burning lactate that is stored in the muscles and this is difficult to do for more than half a minute or so. This represents your actual max heart rate. But that is not you healthy heart rate with is 220-age. This practical heart rate has to do with your metabolic heart rate and will be below your true max heart rate. If you are over 50 and operate for any amount of time over 90% of your max metabolic heart rate you are starving the heart muscles of it's very small storage of lactate. That is, your heart is operating in it's anaerobic. Since the older you are the slower you can reload your muscles (and the heart is a muscle) with lactate and the most chance you have of it seizing up. Bicycling is an endurance sport and that means you must always operate within your aerobic zone. If you start breathing harder and when you back off a little it takes awhile for your heart rate and breathing to come back down you are going too hard. If you are in your aerobic zone when you back off your breathing will almost immediately back down as well. Maybe that's the sign. For me heavy breathing usually slows down within 5-10sec so I guess that counts as "immediate". Sometimes I pass road bikers on fancy machines decked out in expensive lycra and it seems some don't like it when a guy above 50 passes them in T-shirt and jeans on an old steel frame bike. "This is not going to happen!" and then they start following me, breathing hard. Until they drop back, and that's probably pushing it too hard in their cardiac department. Sometimes it's the other way around and I try to follow but when I realize that the guy or gal is doing a sustained 25mph I drop back. Too old for that. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#4
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Age and Heart Rates
On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 1:25:57 PM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-12-10 13:13, wrote: On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 11:22:06 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Your heart rate will increase linearly as long as you're in the aerobic zone. If you go into the anaerobic zone it will only increase a little. At this time the muscles start burning lactate that is stored in the muscles and this is difficult to do for more than half a minute or so. This represents your actual max heart rate. But that is not you healthy heart rate with is 220-age. This practical heart rate has to do with your metabolic heart rate and will be below your true max heart rate. If you are over 50 and operate for any amount of time over 90% of your max metabolic heart rate you are starving the heart muscles of it's very small storage of lactate. That is, your heart is operating in it's anaerobic. Since the older you are the slower you can reload your muscles (and the heart is a muscle) with lactate and the most chance you have of it seizing up. Bicycling is an endurance sport and that means you must always operate within your aerobic zone. If you start breathing harder and when you back off a little it takes awhile for your heart rate and breathing to come back down you are going too hard. If you are in your aerobic zone when you back off your breathing will almost immediately back down as well. Maybe that's the sign. For me heavy breathing usually slows down within 5-10sec so I guess that counts as "immediate". Sometimes I pass road bikers on fancy machines decked out in expensive lycra and it seems some don't like it when a guy above 50 passes them in T-shirt and jeans on an old steel frame bike. "This is not going to happen!" and then they start following me, breathing hard. Until they drop back, and that's probably pushing it too hard in their cardiac department. Sometimes it's the other way around and I try to follow but when I realize that the guy or gal is doing a sustained 25mph I drop back. Too old for that. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Two years ago I did 5 miles at 28 mph with a stop light at every mile marker that was always red. When it changed I would accelerate up to 28 again and hold that steady until I would JUST miss the next light. When I pulled into the parking lot my breathing dropped down pretty rapidly but I had burned up ALL of my lactose and couldn't find my car for almost 10 minutes. I kept riding around in a haze unable to get my bearings. I won't do that again.. |
#5
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Age and Heart Rates
On 2016-12-13 08:37, wrote:
On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 1:25:57 PM UTC-8, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-10 13:13, wrote: On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 11:22:06 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Your heart rate will increase linearly as long as you're in the aerobic zone. If you go into the anaerobic zone it will only increase a little. At this time the muscles start burning lactate that is stored in the muscles and this is difficult to do for more than half a minute or so. This represents your actual max heart rate. But that is not you healthy heart rate with is 220-age. This practical heart rate has to do with your metabolic heart rate and will be below your true max heart rate. If you are over 50 and operate for any amount of time over 90% of your max metabolic heart rate you are starving the heart muscles of it's very small storage of lactate. That is, your heart is operating in it's anaerobic. Since the older you are the slower you can reload your muscles (and the heart is a muscle) with lactate and the most chance you have of it seizing up. Bicycling is an endurance sport and that means you must always operate within your aerobic zone. If you start breathing harder and when you back off a little it takes awhile for your heart rate and breathing to come back down you are going too hard. If you are in your aerobic zone when you back off your breathing will almost immediately back down as well. Maybe that's the sign. For me heavy breathing usually slows down within 5-10sec so I guess that counts as "immediate". Sometimes I pass road bikers on fancy machines decked out in expensive lycra and it seems some don't like it when a guy above 50 passes them in T-shirt and jeans on an old steel frame bike. "This is not going to happen!" and then they start following me, breathing hard. Until they drop back, and that's probably pushing it too hard in their cardiac department. Sometimes it's the other way around and I try to follow but when I realize that the guy or gal is doing a sustained 25mph I drop back. Too old for that. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Two years ago I did 5 miles at 28 mph with a stop light at every mile marker that was always red. When it changed I would accelerate up to 28 again and hold that steady until I would JUST miss the next light. That's a power ride. A neighbor who is very athletic can hold an average of 25mph for more than an hour. Once we went on a road bike ride together and I kept up with him. However, after about an hour I was really finished. Not bonked or anything but he had to cycle back for a business meeting, I continued for another 2h and this time at a much slower pace than usual. When I pulled into the parking lot my breathing dropped down pretty rapidly but I had burned up ALL of my lactose and couldn't find my car for almost 10 minutes. I kept riding around in a haze unable to get my bearings. I won't do that again. That is scary. I wouldn't do it again either. The closest one I came to that status was my first long MTB ride after a hiatus of almost two decades. We got a late start, I had to be home 5h later, my friend is a well-trained road biker and so we both stepped on it. After 4h I bonked, hard. My achievable speed dropped to 30% of normal almost instantly and nothing, neither water nor energy packages, brought that back for the remainder of the ride. I didn't even want to see a bicycle for the next two days. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#6
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Age and Heart Rates
On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 11:22:19 -0800, Joerg
wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? Actual heart rate varies considerably between individuals and even among rating systems. The calculation for "max heart rate" depends, to an extent, on what system you are using. Most people, if they are athletic at all can produce a heart rate that is higher than the calculated maximum heart rate. Heart rate is usually used as a part of a training schedule, i.e., 30 minutes at 100% followed by 10 minutes at 20%", or whatever, and is a method of determining the intensity of the exercise. Back in the primitive days people used do essentially the same thing by training by distance, i.e., a quarter as hard as you can go followed by a quarter at a walk, and so on. As for your full tilt for hours, you really aren't doing that. What you are doing is riding at an energy output that you can maintain for some period. If you really were to exert 100% you might get a quarter of a mile before you collapsed. -- cheers, John B. |
#7
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Age and Heart Rates
On 2016-12-11 00:50, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 11:22:19 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? Actual heart rate varies considerably between individuals and even among rating systems. The calculation for "max heart rate" depends, to an extent, on what system you are using. Most people, if they are athletic at all can produce a heart rate that is higher than the calculated maximum heart rate. Heart rate is usually used as a part of a training schedule, i.e., 30 minutes at 100% followed ... Wow. I thought that long at redline would be damaging to the heart muscles. But I am not an expert, all I did so far is design electronics for cardiac diagnostics. ... by 10 minutes at 20%", or whatever, and is a method of determining the intensity of the exercise. Sounds like what cyclists call intervall training. Back in the primitive days people used do essentially the same thing by training by distance, i.e., a quarter as hard as you can go followed by a quarter at a walk, and so on. As for your full tilt for hours, you really aren't doing that. What you are doing is riding at an energy output that you can maintain for some period. If you really were to exert 100% you might get a quarter of a mile before you collapsed. Yes, that is what I think as well. My limitation is more the breathing and I don't enjoy being totally out of breath for a long time. I was always an endurance kind of guy, never a good sprinter. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#8
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Age and Heart Rates
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 07:21:20 -0800, Joerg
wrote: On 2016-12-11 00:50, John B. wrote: On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 11:22:19 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? Actual heart rate varies considerably between individuals and even among rating systems. The calculation for "max heart rate" depends, to an extent, on what system you are using. Most people, if they are athletic at all can produce a heart rate that is higher than the calculated maximum heart rate. Heart rate is usually used as a part of a training schedule, i.e., 30 minutes at 100% followed ... Wow. I thought that long at redline would be damaging to the heart muscles. But I am not an expert, all I did so far is design electronics for cardiac diagnostics. I thought it was obvious that the example you quoted was an example not an exact recommendation :-) The "maximum heart rate" as usually used in training is just a formula. The basic formula is 220 - age = maximum heart rate, or maybe 208 - (0.7 x age in years), or maybe 206.9-(0.67*Age), or maybe one of calculation that various studies have developed. These various calculations apply to individuals only in a general way. Then we have the formula to calculate level of effort: " Target Heart Rate = ((max HR x resting HR) × %100) + resting HR. ... by 10 minutes at 20%", or whatever, and is a method of determining the intensity of the exercise. Sounds like what cyclists call intervall training. It is. If you add in the long rides. For example, Monday 1 min at 90% followed by 1 min walk (continue until you vomit); Tuesday 1 hour at race intensity, Wednesday rest, and so on. The long days can be thought of single intervals. Back in the primitive days people used do essentially the same thing by training by distance, i.e., a quarter as hard as you can go followed by a quarter at a walk, and so on. As for your full tilt for hours, you really aren't doing that. What you are doing is riding at an energy output that you can maintain for some period. If you really were to exert 100% you might get a quarter of a mile before you collapsed. Yes, that is what I think as well. My limitation is more the breathing and I don't enjoy being totally out of breath for a long time. I was always an endurance kind of guy, never a good sprinter. Yes, endurance is generally determined by oxygen intake. Yes, runners and bicycle sprinters can perform at higher intensities but only for short times. A "miler" will run three laps at about maximum oxygen intake and the last lap he will accelerate and go into oxygen deficiency. -- cheers, John B. |
#9
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Age and Heart Rates
On 2016-12-12 16:24, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 07:21:20 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-11 00:50, John B. wrote: On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 11:22:19 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? Actual heart rate varies considerably between individuals and even among rating systems. The calculation for "max heart rate" depends, to an extent, on what system you are using. Most people, if they are athletic at all can produce a heart rate that is higher than the calculated maximum heart rate. Heart rate is usually used as a part of a training schedule, i.e., 30 minutes at 100% followed ... Wow. I thought that long at redline would be damaging to the heart muscles. But I am not an expert, all I did so far is design electronics for cardiac diagnostics. I thought it was obvious that the example you quoted was an example not an exact recommendation :-) The "maximum heart rate" as usually used in training is just a formula. The basic formula is 220 - age = maximum heart rate, or maybe 208 - (0.7 x age in years), or maybe 206.9-(0.67*Age), or maybe one of calculation that various studies have developed. These various calculations apply to individuals only in a general way. Then we have the formula to calculate level of effort: " Target Heart Rate = ((max HR x resting HR) × %100) + resting HR. ... by 10 minutes at 20%", or whatever, and is a method of determining the intensity of the exercise. Sounds like what cyclists call intervall training. It is. If you add in the long rides. For example, Monday 1 min at 90% followed by 1 min walk (continue until you vomit); Tuesday 1 hour at race intensity, Wednesday rest, and so on. The long days can be thought of single intervals. I think it's different, more like what Lee said. Where a sprint maxes out the muscles. I don't max out mine much, meaning I could hammer up a hill faster but then I'd be pooped for many minutes and the ride would no longer be an enjoyable one. Back in the primitive days people used do essentially the same thing by training by distance, i.e., a quarter as hard as you can go followed by a quarter at a walk, and so on. As for your full tilt for hours, you really aren't doing that. What you are doing is riding at an energy output that you can maintain for some period. If you really were to exert 100% you might get a quarter of a mile before you collapsed. Yes, that is what I think as well. My limitation is more the breathing and I don't enjoy being totally out of breath for a long time. I was always an endurance kind of guy, never a good sprinter. Yes, endurance is generally determined by oxygen intake. Yes, runners and bicycle sprinters can perform at higher intensities but only for short times. A "miler" will run three laps at about maximum oxygen intake and the last lap he will accelerate and go into oxygen deficiency. Seen it but I was never good at that. Even in the army my better times were long-haul. 5km on the sports field, xx kilometer on "hikes" in full gear. With cycling it is similar. Yesterday was 43mi or 69km, to pick up a $1.75 item in the valley that I urgently need. About 30% of that ride was extra and just for fun. However, after this discussion I tried some muscle max-out phases and paid for that the last 10mi which are almost all uphill. I see that sometimes where guys blast by me at high speed and then on the next long hill I pass them. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#10
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Age and Heart Rates
On Tue, 13 Dec 2016 07:54:13 -0800, Joerg
wrote: On 2016-12-12 16:24, John B. wrote: On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 07:21:20 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-11 00:50, John B. wrote: On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 11:22:19 -0800, Joerg wrote: On 2016-12-05 09:21, wrote: I am seldom riding with the local old folks group because they have a habit of racing all the time. Then 3/4ths of the way into a ride they get really tired and are dragging up the final hills. I don't like climbing as fast as possible nor trying to keep up on the flats to people 5 years older than me that are maintaining heart rates at 90%. And this is directly out of the box with not one minute of warm-up. Now I like to exercise at elevated rates so riding with the "easy" groups is out. But I don't riding with people whose objective is to beat someone else to the top of the hill as if this proves them superior. And this soon degenerates into not waiting for the slower members. Unfortunately, these acts of proving one's self better than others can significantly shorten the live's of those over 55. If you are one of those that must prove yourself on every ride there is a target rate on http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Health...1_Article.jsp# If you regularly ride above these rates you are a heart attack waiting to happen. Not to mention that often you are pulling the entire group above their safe zones. Let's ride as smart as well as fast. What is a good way to gauge the heart rate if the bike is not equipped with a whole smorgasbord of medical devices such as pulse meters? Taking one hand off the bar and counting wrist pulses isn't very safe in most places around here. I sometimes get carried away on long boring stretches and find myself riding full tilt. Whatever "the engine" can deliver goes into the pedals. But I usually don't become tired after an hour. Or two. Or four. Is that a good enough indicator to be in the healthy zone? Actual heart rate varies considerably between individuals and even among rating systems. The calculation for "max heart rate" depends, to an extent, on what system you are using. Most people, if they are athletic at all can produce a heart rate that is higher than the calculated maximum heart rate. Heart rate is usually used as a part of a training schedule, i.e., 30 minutes at 100% followed ... Wow. I thought that long at redline would be damaging to the heart muscles. But I am not an expert, all I did so far is design electronics for cardiac diagnostics. I thought it was obvious that the example you quoted was an example not an exact recommendation :-) The "maximum heart rate" as usually used in training is just a formula. The basic formula is 220 - age = maximum heart rate, or maybe 208 - (0.7 x age in years), or maybe 206.9-(0.67*Age), or maybe one of calculation that various studies have developed. These various calculations apply to individuals only in a general way. Then we have the formula to calculate level of effort: " Target Heart Rate = ((max HR x resting HR) × %100) + resting HR. ... by 10 minutes at 20%", or whatever, and is a method of determining the intensity of the exercise. Sounds like what cyclists call intervall training. It is. If you add in the long rides. For example, Monday 1 min at 90% followed by 1 min walk (continue until you vomit); Tuesday 1 hour at race intensity, Wednesday rest, and so on. The long days can be thought of single intervals. I think it's different, more like what Lee said. Where a sprint maxes out the muscles. I don't max out mine much, meaning I could hammer up a hill faster but then I'd be pooped for many minutes and the ride would no longer be an enjoyable one. It gets very complicated. For example, there are fast twitch muscle fibers and slow twitch fibers. Doing sprints certainly causes the fast twitch fibers to grow but has a lesser effect on the slow twitch fibers. On the other hand, a series of stresses placed on the legs, for instance, certainly strengthens all the leg muscles. I used to do hill climbs. A hill ling enough that I ran out of breath and start in the lowest gets and ride to a certain place, coast back down to the bottom, shift up a gear and do the same thing. Theoretically this is a fast twitch exercise good for sprinters but it also improved my average speed for a 2 - 3 hour ride. Back in the primitive days people used do essentially the same thing by training by distance, i.e., a quarter as hard as you can go followed by a quarter at a walk, and so on. As for your full tilt for hours, you really aren't doing that. What you are doing is riding at an energy output that you can maintain for some period. If you really were to exert 100% you might get a quarter of a mile before you collapsed. Yes, that is what I think as well. My limitation is more the breathing and I don't enjoy being totally out of breath for a long time. I was always an endurance kind of guy, never a good sprinter. Yes, endurance is generally determined by oxygen intake. Yes, runners and bicycle sprinters can perform at higher intensities but only for short times. A "miler" will run three laps at about maximum oxygen intake and the last lap he will accelerate and go into oxygen deficiency. Seen it but I was never good at that. Even in the army my better times were long-haul. 5km on the sports field, xx kilometer on "hikes" in full gear. With cycling it is similar. Yesterday was 43mi or 69km, to pick up a $1.75 item in the valley that I urgently need. About 30% of that ride was extra and just for fun. However, after this discussion I tried some muscle max-out phases and paid for that the last 10mi which are almost all uphill. Sure, you exceeded the effort that you can maintain for the entire ride. I see that sometimes where guys blast by me at high speed and then on the next long hill I pass them. I also see that sometimes guys blast by me at high speed and then go on out of sight :-) -- cheers, John B. |
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