two-wheeled scum murdering pedestrians again

On Apr 8, 6:48*am, Tony Dragon wrote:
On 08/04/2011 06:29, Rob Morley wrote:





On Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:15:33 +0100
Tony *wrote:

On 07/04/2011 18:29, Tony Raven wrote:
...@r ocketmail.com
wrote:
On Apr 7, 3:46 pm, Sedentary IgnorantPopulist

Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road (forget
the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.

Would you agree that the owner of a bicycle does not have to pay a
specific tax/duty/etc(s)c to enable him to use the bicycle on the
road (forget the exceptions)?

No equivalent to VED no, but then they class as Band A if you did
want to classify them so it would be zero anyway.

Was the question to difficult?

Apparently the answer was.

Before I get jumped on by the pedants, I will reply again.

The answer was evasive, the question asked was not personal to him.
But he seems to agree that a bicycle owner/user does not pay.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Here we go again.

See Janet in her car.
It's a band F car.
Janet has never paid a penny in VED, fuel duty or VAT on fuel,
repairs, insurance, MOTs, yada yada yada.
Janet's cycling husband pays all of it.
Therefore cyclist and bicycle owner, John pays all of the tax that
goes with owning and running a car.
The driver Janet pays nothing at all and never has.
Janet is, in the common parlance, a freeloading motoring scum who pays
nothing towards running a car.

--
Simon Mason

Tony Dragon wrote:
On 08/04/2011 06:29, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:15:33 +0100
Tony wrote:

On 07/04/2011 18:29, Tony Raven wrote:
@r ocketmail.com
wrote:
On Apr 7, 3:46 pm, Sedentary IgnorantPopulist

Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road (forget
the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.


Would you agree that the owner of a bicycle does not have to pay a
specific tax/duty/etc(s)c to enable him to use the bicycle on the
road (forget the exceptions)?

No equivalent to VED no, but then they class as Band A if you did
want to classify them so it would be zero anyway.



Was the question to difficult?

Apparently the answer was.



The answer was evasive, the question asked was not personal to him.
But he seems to agree that a bicycle does not pay.

It was not. No-one HAS to pay VED to drive a car. They have a number of
Band A cars to chose from. No-one is forcing them to use a higher banded
car. It's a free choice but many seem to elect to buy one where they have
to pay VED. That's hardly a reason to complain about "having" to pay it.

I didn't say a bicycle doesn't pay. I said it doesn't pay VED which is
consistent with other vehicles with it's carbon output.

--
Tony

On Thu, 7 Apr 2011,
On Apr 7, 6:29Â*pm, Tony Raven wrote:

[possibly Thomas wrote, but I've scrambled the attributions]:
Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road
(forget the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.


Oh dear, did I say you, no, I said the owner of a car.
Did I say forget the exceptions, yes.
Do you want to try again, or do you want to try another wriggle?

Do you really think the answer to the question "Do you have to pay tax
to use a car for which you have to pay tax?" is a useful way to
advance the debate?

You could prove that no cyclists pays income tax: "Ignoring all the
cyclists that pay income tax, how much income tax does the average
cyclist pay?" Or you could prove that every motorist is properly
insured: "Ignoring the ones that aren't properly insured, how many
motorists don't have valid insurance?"

In general, as a matter of principle, no you do not need to pay a
specific tax to use a car on the road.

For some particular cars, yes you do have to pay a specific tax to use
that car on the roads. As it happens there are more particular
examples that do than that don't, but since a large number don't it
cannot be a fundamental principle that cars need to have tax paid on
them.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

Ian Smith wrote:
On Thu, 7 Apr 2011,
On Apr 7, 6:29 pm, Tony Raven wrote:

[possibly Thomas wrote, but I've scrambled the attributions]:
Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road
(forget the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.


Oh dear, did I say you, no, I said the owner of a car.
Did I say forget the exceptions, yes.
Do you want to try again, or do you want to try another wriggle?

Do you really think the answer to the question "Do you have to pay tax
to use a car for which you have to pay tax?" is a useful way to
advance the debate?

You could prove that no cyclists pays income tax: "Ignoring all the
cyclists that pay income tax, how much income tax does the average
cyclist pay?" Or you could prove that every motorist is properly
insured: "Ignoring the ones that aren't properly insured, how many
motorists don't have valid insurance?"

In general, as a matter of principle, no you do not need to pay a
specific tax to use a car on the road.

For some particular cars, yes you do have to pay a specific tax to use
that car on the roads. As it happens there are more particular
examples that do than that don't, but since a large number don't it
cannot be a fundamental principle that cars need to have tax paid on
them.

regards, Ian SMith

so the majority of car owners pay road tax.

On Apr 8, 7:17*am, Simon Mason wrote:
On Apr 8, 6:48*am, Tony Dragon wrote:





On 08/04/2011 06:29, Rob Morley wrote:

On Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:15:33 +0100
Tony *wrote:

On 07/04/2011 18:29, Tony Raven wrote:
...@r ocketmail.com
wrote:
On Apr 7, 3:46 pm, Sedentary IgnorantPopulist

Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road (forget
the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.

Would you agree that the owner of a bicycle does not have to pay a
specific tax/duty/etc(s)c to enable him to use the bicycle on the
road (forget the exceptions)?

No equivalent to VED no, but then they class as Band A if you did
want to classify them so it would be zero anyway.

Was the question to difficult?

Apparently the answer was.

Before I get jumped on by the pedants, I will reply again.

The answer was evasive, the question asked was not personal to him.
But he seems to agree that a bicycle owner/user does not pay.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Here we go again.

See Janet in her car.
It's a band F car.
Janet has never paid a penny in VED, fuel duty or VAT on fuel,
repairs, insurance, MOTs, yada yada yada.
Janet's cycling husband pays all of it.
Therefore cyclist and bicycle owner, John pays all of the tax that
goes with owning and running a car.
The driver Janet pays nothing at all and never has.
Janet is, in the common parlance, a freeloading motoring scum who pays
nothing towards running a car.

--
Simon Mason- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So you agree that the owner of the car has to pay "a specific tax/
duty/ etc(s)"

On Apr 8, 7:59*am, Tony Raven wrote:
Tony Dragon wrote:
On 08/04/2011 06:29, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:15:33 +0100
Tony *wrote:

On 07/04/2011 18:29, Tony Raven wrote:
...@r ocketmail.com
wrote:
On Apr 7, 3:46 pm, Sedentary IgnorantPopulist

Would you agree that the owner of a car has to pay a specific
tax/duty/ etc(s) to enable him to use the car on the road (forget
the exceptions)?

No, I use a Band A car where no VED is payable.

Would you agree that the owner of a bicycle does not have to pay a
specific tax/duty/etc(s)c to enable him to use the bicycle on the
road (forget the exceptions)?

No equivalent to VED no, but then they class as Band A if you did
want to classify them so it would be zero anyway.

Was the question to difficult?

Apparently the answer was.

The answer was evasive, the question asked was not personal to him.
But he seems to agree that a bicycle does not pay.

It was not. *No-one HAS to pay VED to drive a car. *They have a number of
Band A cars to chose from. *No-one is forcing them to use a higher banded
car. *It's a free choice but many seem to elect to buy one where they have
to pay VED. *That's hardly a reason to complain about "having" to pay it.

"Mrcheerful" wrote:

so the majority of car owners pay road tax.

Probably but since none of them actually needs to, one must assume they are
happy to voluntarily pay that tax so they can drive a bigger more polluting
car.

--
Tony

On Apr 8, 11:52*am, Tony Raven wrote:
"Mrcheerful" wrote:
so the majority of car owners pay road tax.

Probably but since none of them actually needs to, one must assume they are
happy to voluntarily pay that tax so they can drive a bigger more polluting
car.

--
Tony

Indeed. I pay £245 a year for the privilege and I hardly ever use it.
Is there a way of me getting a rebate for not wearing out the bit of
road that I am entitled to wear out, having supposedly "paid for it"?

--
Simon Mason

francis wrote:

The question seemed to be about paying VED etc, not complaining, I
presume that the exception(s) mentioned were to do with excempt
vehicles.

No, the question was whether you HAD to pay tax. Band A vehicles are not
exempt, they are zero rated so you pay no tax. The next bands up, Bands B,
C & D are zero rated for the first year an £20, £30 & £95 pa thereafter
respectively. If you really want to drive a Band M car and pay £460 pa to
be able to drive a heavily polluting car you can but no-one can say you
HAD to drive it.

Well to my mind a cycle owner does not pay a specific tax to allow a
cycle to use the road, feel free to correct me.

Neither do 2 million car owners. It's only the socially irresponsible ones
who insist on paying the tax so they can drive a more polluting car that
do.

--
Tony

On Apr 8, 12:49*pm, Tony Raven wrote:
francis wrote:
The question seemed to be about paying VED etc, not complaining, I
presume that the exception(s) mentioned were to do with excempt
vehicles.

No, the question was whether you HAD to pay tax. *Band A vehicles are not
exempt, they are zero rated so you pay no tax. *The next bands up, Bands B,
C & D are zero rated for the first year an £20, £30 & £95 pa thereafter
respectively. *If you really want to drive a Band M car and pay £460 pa to
be able to drive a heavily polluting car *you can but no-one can say you
HAD to drive it.

Well to my mind a cycle owner does not pay a specific tax to allow a
cycle to use the road, feel free to correct me.

Neither do 2 million car owners. *It's only the socially irresponsible ones
who insist on paying the tax so they can drive a more polluting car that
do.

--
Tony

So you agree that a cycle owner does not have to pay a specific tax to
allow a cycle to be used on the roads, at last.

At to paying for VED etc, as I read it the zero rated vehicles were
the exceptions, being in the minority.