Games Lanes

On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 13:58:44 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 9:22*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 12:13:28 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:



On Jul 30, 4:16*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 07:50:08 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 2:31 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 05:55:58 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 1:38 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:

Well there you go, I had you marked as a leftie but you now show up as
a right wing capitalist looking to profit out of the toils of the
working class, do your 'right on' chums in Greenwich know what you are
all about?

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059

Do keep up!

Why? where does it say I was referring to the borough.

Oh! Were you referring to somewhere other than Royal Greenwich? If you
were please accept my sincere apologies, I had no idea you were
referring to Greenwich Village in New York or some other "Greenwich".

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.

I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.

And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.

Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?

And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

My old postal address was SE8, 200 yards up the road was SE10
(Greenwich) had my house been in SE10 it's value would have been
approaching double.

House prices in London can vary enormously by street, but I've never
heard of such a huge difference by postcode.

On 31/07/2012 08:32, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:53:07 +0100, ®i©ardo wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:47, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:36:13 +0100, JNugent
wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:22, Bertie Wooster wrote:

NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059
Do keep up!

[ ... ]

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.
I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.
And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.
Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?
And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

It's just a confusing aspect of the unintended interface between modern (or
perhaps "current") local government and the internal operations of the Post
Office.

The PO is autonomous in how it sets postal districts and this or that London
postal district has no necessary meaning in terms of local government
boundaries. Don't expect it to make sense.

Separately, if you ask the average Londoner what you (must) mean if you say
that you live in Greenwich, you are unlikely to be told that it must mean you
live in Woolwich, Eltham, (the north side of) Blackheath or Charlton. They'll
probably assume you mean Greenwich. That is, the area roughly north of the
A2, south of the river, east of the creek and west of the Blackwall Tunnel
Approach Road.

Yes, I think that is a very reasonable definition.

My "chums" in Greenwich Cyclists, who I was supposing NM was referring
to, live all over the Royal Borough.

Now I know that he was only referring to the area you defined.


Is it not the case that only true "royal" bit in that area is Eltham
which, with its royal palace often graces itself with the title of
"Royal Eltham"?

Eltham is outside the area Nugent defined; the palace has a celebrated
its septcentenary and has been a home for many kings and queens.


But it is still within what was The London Borough of Greenwich!

--
Moving things in still pictures

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:49:01 +0100, Bertie Wooster
wrote:

snip


House prices in London can vary enormously by street, but I've never
heard of such a huge difference by postcode.


Insurance companies base their risk assessments on postcodes.

This means that you can have a house on one side of a street in a "high risk"
post code area - whereas the houses on the other side of the street are not so
at risk.

This leads to the change of desirability of houses in one post code area
compared with another.

Just because you have never heard of it doesn't not mean that it is not true.

But we had already concluded that.

On Jul 31, 8:49*am, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 13:58:44 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:



On Jul 30, 9:22*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 12:13:28 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 4:16*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 07:50:08 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 2:31 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 05:55:58 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 1:38 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:

Well there you go, I had you marked as a leftie but you now show up as
a right wing capitalist looking to profit out of the toils of the
working class, do your 'right on' chums in Greenwich know what you are
all about?

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059

Do keep up!

Why? where does it say I was referring to the borough.

Oh! Were you referring to somewhere other than Royal Greenwich? If you
were please accept my sincere apologies, I had no idea you were
referring to Greenwich Village in New York or some other "Greenwich".

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.

I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district.. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.

And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.

Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?

And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

My old postal address was SE8, 200 yards up the road was SE10
(Greenwich) had my house been in SE10 it's value would have been
approaching double.

House prices in London can vary enormously by street, but I've never
heard of such a huge difference by postcode.

Here is a picture of the first house I ever owned,

http://www.ideal-homes.org.uk/lewish...hill,-deptford

Grade 2 listed, un-mortgageable unless one has megga deposit. being
local you will know where it is, what would the value be on the other
side of Deptford Creek in the Royal Borough of Greenwich.

Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:36:13 +0100, JNugent
wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:22, Bertie Wooster wrote:

NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059
Do keep up!

[ ... ]

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.
I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.
And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.
Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?
And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

It's just a confusing aspect of the unintended interface between modern (or
perhaps "current") local government and the internal operations of the Post
Office.

The PO is autonomous in how it sets postal districts and this or that London
postal district has no necessary meaning in terms of local government
boundaries. Don't expect it to make sense.

Separately, if you ask the average Londoner what you (must) mean if you say
that you live in Greenwich, you are unlikely to be told that it must mean you
live in Woolwich, Eltham, (the north side of) Blackheath or Charlton. They'll
probably assume you mean Greenwich. That is, the area roughly north of the
A2, south of the river, east of the creek and west of the Blackwall Tunnel
Approach Road.

Yes, I think that is a very reasonable definition.

My "chums" in Greenwich Cyclists, who I was supposing NM was referring
to, live all over the Royal Borough.

Now I know that he was only referring to the area you defined.

is that the same Greenwich cyclists that our own Doug belongs?
--
ennemm

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 09:33:47 +0100, ®i©ardo wrote:

On 31/07/2012 08:32, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:53:07 +0100, ®i©ardo wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:47, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:36:13 +0100, JNugent
wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:22, Bertie Wooster wrote:

NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059
Do keep up!

[ ... ]

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.
I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.
And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.
Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?
And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

It's just a confusing aspect of the unintended interface between modern (or
perhaps "current") local government and the internal operations of the Post
Office.

The PO is autonomous in how it sets postal districts and this or that London
postal district has no necessary meaning in terms of local government
boundaries. Don't expect it to make sense.

Separately, if you ask the average Londoner what you (must) mean if you say
that you live in Greenwich, you are unlikely to be told that it must mean you
live in Woolwich, Eltham, (the north side of) Blackheath or Charlton. They'll
probably assume you mean Greenwich. That is, the area roughly north of the
A2, south of the river, east of the creek and west of the Blackwall Tunnel
Approach Road.

Yes, I think that is a very reasonable definition.

My "chums" in Greenwich Cyclists, who I was supposing NM was referring
to, live all over the Royal Borough.

Now I know that he was only referring to the area you defined.


Is it not the case that only true "royal" bit in that area is Eltham
which, with its royal palace often graces itself with the title of
"Royal Eltham"?

Eltham is outside the area Nugent defined; the palace has a celebrated
its septcentenary and has been a home for many kings and queens.


But it is still within what was The London Borough of Greenwich!

Yes, now within the Royal Borough of Greenwich.

I expect that having two royal palaces within the borough was one of
the reasons for the name change.

Previously Greenwich had asked to be elevated to city status.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_B...enwich#History
But was turned down.

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 05:53:06 -0500, nik.morgan wrote:

Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:36:13 +0100, JNugent
wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:22, Bertie Wooster wrote:

NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059
Do keep up!

[ ... ]

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.
I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.
And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.
Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?
And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

It's just a confusing aspect of the unintended interface between modern (or
perhaps "current") local government and the internal operations of the Post
Office.

The PO is autonomous in how it sets postal districts and this or that London
postal district has no necessary meaning in terms of local government
boundaries. Don't expect it to make sense.

Separately, if you ask the average Londoner what you (must) mean if you say
that you live in Greenwich, you are unlikely to be told that it must mean you
live in Woolwich, Eltham, (the north side of) Blackheath or Charlton. They'll
probably assume you mean Greenwich. That is, the area roughly north of the
A2, south of the river, east of the creek and west of the Blackwall Tunnel
Approach Road.

Yes, I think that is a very reasonable definition.

My "chums" in Greenwich Cyclists, who I was supposing NM was referring
to, live all over the Royal Borough.

Now I know that he was only referring to the area you defined.

is that the same Greenwich cyclists that our own Doug belongs?

I understand that Doug has previously been an active member of
Lewisham Cyclists. There was once talk of merging the two groups, but
it never happened.

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 09:39:38 +0100, Judith
wrote:

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:49:01 +0100, Bertie Wooster
wrote:

snip


House prices in London can vary enormously by street, but I've never
heard of such a huge difference by postcode.


Insurance companies base their risk assessments on postcodes.

This means that you can have a house on one side of a street in a "high risk"
post code area - whereas the houses on the other side of the street are not so
at risk.

This leads to the change of desirability of houses in one post code area
compared with another.

Just because you have never heard of it doesn't not mean that it is not true.

But we had already concluded that.

I am fully prepared to accept all you say.

What I find difficult to understand is that the SE10 and SE8 postcodes
*alone* make close to double (or half) the value of a property.

I am willing to believe that a house in SE10, overlooking the Thames,
Greenwich Park, or Blackheath, would be worth double or more a carbon
copy overlooking a scrap metal merchant's yard in Deptford.

I am also fully prepared to believe that NM's house in SE8 was half
the value of a similar house a few roads away in SE10. What I find
very hard to accept is that postcode *alone* made that difference.

On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 02:13:01 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 31, 8:49*am, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 13:58:44 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:



On Jul 30, 9:22*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 12:13:28 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 4:16*pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 07:50:08 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 2:31 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 05:55:58 -0700 (PDT), NM
wrote:

On Jul 30, 1:38 pm, Bertie Wooster wrote:

Well there you go, I had you marked as a leftie but you now show up as
a right wing capitalist looking to profit out of the toils of the
working class, do your 'right on' chums in Greenwich know what you are
all about?

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059

Do keep up!

Why? where does it say I was referring to the borough.

Oh! Were you referring to somewhere other than Royal Greenwich? If you
were please accept my sincere apologies, I had no idea you were
referring to Greenwich Village in New York or some other "Greenwich".

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.

I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.

And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.

Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?

And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

My old postal address was SE8, 200 yards up the road was SE10
(Greenwich) had my house been in SE10 it's value would have been
approaching double.

House prices in London can vary enormously by street, but I've never
heard of such a huge difference by postcode.

Here is a picture of the first house I ever owned,

http://www.ideal-homes.org.uk/lewish...hill,-deptford

Grade 2 listed, un-mortgageable unless one has megga deposit. being
local you will know where it is, what would the value be on the other
side of Deptford Creek in the Royal Borough of Greenwich.

There was an excellent bike shop there until recently:
http://goo.gl/maps/mOku

I expect the reason for the low value compared with a few roads away
is this:
http://goo.gl/maps/kaRv

On 31/07/2012 13:23, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 09:33:47 +0100, ®i©ardo wrote:

On 31/07/2012 08:32, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:53:07 +0100, ®i©ardo wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:47, Bertie Wooster wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:36:13 +0100, JNugent
wrote:

On 30/07/2012 21:22, Bertie Wooster wrote:

NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:
NM wrote:
Bertie Wooster wrote:

The borough is now known as Royal Greenwich, and has been since 2
February 2012.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16839059
Do keep up!

[ ... ]

I was referring to Greenwich, the place I used to live and work in,
situated between Deptford, and Blackheath on the south bank of the
river thames.
I was not aware the Royal addition to the name of the entire borough
had in fact also been applied to the town as well, anyway I accept you
were misguided and hear your apology.

The SE10 postal district, is also bounded by Charlton.

I now assume, that by "Greenwich Town" you mean the postal district. I
cannot think of an alternative definition. If that is the case, I am
not convinced that "Greenwich Town" falls entirely within Royal
Greenwich. Small parts may well be in Lewisham. Indeed, a cursory
glance at Street Map confirms that is the case. Therefore your
reference to "Greenwich" was doubly befuddling: how was I to know that
you were referring to parts of Lewisham?

Why are you nitpicking, you know exactly what I meant, do you really
think it's worth while to persue this? Is it brownie points you seek?

Just trying to be clear.
And for the record, most of my "chums" who live in the Royal Borough,
live outside the SE10 postal district, including a "chum" who lives in
the Deptford postal district but within the Royal Borough.
Would you count that as Greenwich, Lewisham or Deptford?
And Lee, my postal district, is in Lewisham, Royal Greenwich and
Bromley.

It's just a confusing aspect of the unintended interface between modern (or
perhaps "current") local government and the internal operations of the Post
Office.

The PO is autonomous in how it sets postal districts and this or that London
postal district has no necessary meaning in terms of local government
boundaries. Don't expect it to make sense.

Separately, if you ask the average Londoner what you (must) mean if you say
that you live in Greenwich, you are unlikely to be told that it must mean you
live in Woolwich, Eltham, (the north side of) Blackheath or Charlton. They'll
probably assume you mean Greenwich. That is, the area roughly north of the
A2, south of the river, east of the creek and west of the Blackwall Tunnel
Approach Road.

Yes, I think that is a very reasonable definition.

My "chums" in Greenwich Cyclists, who I was supposing NM was referring
to, live all over the Royal Borough.

Now I know that he was only referring to the area you defined.


Is it not the case that only true "royal" bit in that area is Eltham
which, with its royal palace often graces itself with the title of
"Royal Eltham"?

Eltham is outside the area Nugent defined; the palace has a celebrated
its septcentenary and has been a home for many kings and queens.


But it is still within what was The London Borough of Greenwich!

Yes, now within the Royal Borough of Greenwich.

I expect that having two royal palaces within the borough was one of
the reasons for the name change.

Previously Greenwich had asked to be elevated to city status.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_B...enwich#History
But was turned down.


We must be thankful for small mercies.

;-)

Thank you for your guidance.

--
Moving things in still pictures