Need stretch: stem or seat post?

I like my new Rockhopper Comp, but it's a bit cramped. On a trail that's
not a big deal but I do ride it on the road, where comfort in a stable
position is nice. I currently have the saddle shoved way back on the
seat post, with commensurate creaking from the slightly stressed item.

I could get that extra bit of reach with a longer stem or tweaked
handlebars, but I'm more afraid of downhill endo's than uphill wheelies.
I'm also a strong glute-and-quad pedaler with good knees (so far) and
ample upper body weight by which to tweak my center of gravity on a slope.

So I'm leaning towards moving the saddle back further instead of the
bars forward. I'd like a seat post with some set back, maybe 2" worth.

Your thoughts and equipment suggestions?

--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the
trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view,
the most insidious of traitors."
George H.W. Bush, April 16, 1999,

Raptor wrote:
I like my new Rockhopper Comp, but it's a bit cramped. On a trail
that's not a big deal but I do ride it on the road, where comfort in
a stable position is nice. I currently have the saddle shoved way
back on the seat post, with commensurate creaking from the slightly
stressed item.

I could get that extra bit of reach with a longer stem or tweaked
handlebars, but I'm more afraid of downhill endo's than uphill
wheelies. I'm also a strong glute-and-quad pedaler with good knees
(so far) and ample upper body weight by which to tweak my center of
gravity on a slope.
So I'm leaning towards moving the saddle back further instead of the
bars forward. I'd like a seat post with some set back, maybe 2" worth.

Your thoughts and equipment suggestions?

General rule of thumb is to adjust reach with the stem, not the saddle
placement. Have someone check your position on the bike?

Sorni

Raptor wrote:
I like my new Rockhopper Comp, but it's a bit cramped. On a trail that's
not a big deal but I do ride it on the road, where comfort in a stable
position is nice. I currently have the saddle shoved way back on the
seat post, with commensurate creaking from the slightly stressed item.

I could get that extra bit of reach with a longer stem or tweaked
handlebars, but I'm more afraid of downhill endo's than uphill wheelies.
I'm also a strong glute-and-quad pedaler with good knees (so far) and
ample upper body weight by which to tweak my center of gravity on a slope.

So I'm leaning towards moving the saddle back further instead of the
bars forward. I'd like a seat post with some set back, maybe 2" worth.

Your thoughts and equipment suggestions?

--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the
trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view,
the most insidious of traitors."
George H.W. Bush, April 16, 1999, Get your hands on a threadless adjustable Stem. Nahbar has um along with a few other companies.

Raptor wrote:

I like my new Rockhopper Comp, but it's a bit cramped. On a trail that's
not a big deal but I do ride it on the road, where comfort in a stable
position is nice. I currently have the saddle shoved way back on the
seat post, with commensurate creaking from the slightly stressed item.

As Bill S mentioned, you should get the crank-to-saddle position
correct, THEN get the "cockpit length" right, not the other way
around.

It's pretty much a given that you'll have to compromise if you are
going to ride your Rockhopper on the road and off the road
(particularly if "off the road" includes technical riding). The ideal
position for each type of riding is different, so one or both
positions will have to be a compromise.

I could get that extra bit of reach with a longer stem or tweaked
handlebars, but I'm more afraid of downhill endo's than uphill wheelies.
I'm also a strong glute-and-quad pedaler with good knees (so far) and
ample upper body weight by which to tweak my center of gravity on a slope.

So I'm leaning towards moving the saddle back further instead of the
bars forward. I'd like a seat post with some set back, maybe 2" worth.

Your thoughts and equipment suggestions?

Get a bike that fits. Figure out a good compromise position, but
start with a bike that'll let you get it all right. Don't screw up
the engine compartment just to get the steering wheel in the right
position.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

Per Mark Hickey:
It's pretty much a given that you'll have to compromise if you are
going to ride your Rockhopper on the road and off the road
(particularly if "off the road" includes technical riding). The ideal
position for each type of riding is different, so one or both
positions will have to be a compromise.

I ran up against that with my semi-custom FS. The maker spec'd a stem that put
me in the perfect position for road riding - but made me afraid to descend any
sort of steep hill.

I had riser bars on it anyhow, so to avoid buying a shorter stem I just canted
them back an inch or two. Then I put bar ends on - the really long ones that
bend inward - and canted them forwards and slightly down.

Riding half on the bar ends and half on the bars puts me back in the maker's
recommended position, holding the bars normally leaves me comfortable for
descents, and really getting out on the bar ends lets me go more aero that I'd
ever really want/need to.

I like it...
--
PeteCresswell

(PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Mark Hickey:
It's pretty much a given that you'll have to compromise if you are
going to ride your Rockhopper on the road and off the road
(particularly if "off the road" includes technical riding). The ideal
position for each type of riding is different, so one or both
positions will have to be a compromise.

I ran up against that with my semi-custom FS. The maker spec'd a stem that put
me in the perfect position for road riding - but made me afraid to descend any
sort of steep hill.

Just to make sure I'm following along here... Road riding calls for a
more aerodynamic (lower) upper-body profile. This pushes the rider's
center of gravity forward. Descending a steep trail in the same position
thus involves a greater risk of falling over the bars. Are we on the
same page?

I had riser bars on it anyhow, so to avoid buying a shorter stem I just canted
them back an inch or two. Then I put bar ends on - the really long ones that
bend inward - and canted them forwards and slightly down.

Riser bars would raise your hands, right? Not as good for road riding.
Why would you be looking to buy a shorter stem? It sounds like you
wanted a "longer" place to put your hands, so you installed long bar
ends, then pointed them down vaguely like you'd see on a time-trial
racing bike. Right?

Riding half on the bar ends and half on the bars puts me back in the maker's
recommended position, holding the bars normally leaves me comfortable for
descents, and really getting out on the bar ends lets me go more aero that I'd
ever really want/need to.

I like it...

I just added bar ends to my bike, its only modification so far (other
than pushing the saddle back on the existing seat post). I haven't
ridden it since, so it could be that I can be happy by moving my hands
forward that couple of inches.

--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the
trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view,
the most insidious of traitors."
George H.W. Bush, April 16, 1999,

"Raptor" wrote in message
...
I like my new Rockhopper Comp, but it's a bit cramped. On a trail that's
not a big deal but I do ride it on the road, where comfort in a stable
position is nice. I currently have the saddle shoved way back on the
seat post, with commensurate creaking from the slightly stressed item.

I could get that extra bit of reach with a longer stem or tweaked
handlebars, but I'm more afraid of downhill endo's than uphill wheelies.
I'm also a strong glute-and-quad pedaler with good knees (so far) and
ample upper body weight by which to tweak my center of gravity on a slope.

So I'm leaning towards moving the saddle back further instead of the
bars forward. I'd like a seat post with some set back, maybe 2" worth.

Your thoughts and equipment suggestions?

I'm not really advocating it but I ride with my seat right back and a short
stem. I just ended up that way from lots of incremental changes and maybe
the fact my legs are slightly short for my height.
I like the quick steering of a short stem and tend to ride with a lot of
weight on the rear wheel (quite often 100%).
Disadvantages include front wheel washout, bent seat rails and bent seat
posts.

Per Raptor:
Road riding calls for a
more aerodynamic (lower) upper-body profile. This pushes the rider's
center of gravity forward. Descending a steep trail in the same position
thus involves a greater risk of falling over the bars. Are we on the
same page?

Yes

I had riser bars on it anyhow, so to avoid buying a shorter stem I just canted
them back an inch or two. Then I put bar ends on - the really long ones that
bend inward - and canted them forwards and slightly down.

Riser bars would raise your hands, right?

Not if the stem is lowered a like amount. Hand height is the sum of bar rise
and stem height. If somebody replaced flat bars with risers without moving the
stem down then yes - the bar height would increase. But there's nothing about
risers per-se that means bars are higher... unless, of course, you have a bike
on which the steering tube has been cut off to leave no room for stem
adjustment.

Why would you be looking to buy a shorter stem? It sounds like you
wanted a "longer" place to put your hands

Not longer than the maker's spec. The bars were already there.


... you installed long bar
ends, then pointed them down vaguely like you'd see on a time-trial
racing bike. Right?

Yes.

--
PeteCresswell

Per Duncan:
I'm not really advocating it but I ride with my seat right back and a short
stem. I just ended up that way from lots of incremental changes and maybe
the fact my legs are slightly short for my height.
I like the quick steering of a short stem and tend to ride with a lot of
weight on the rear wheel (quite often 100%).
Disadvantages include front wheel washout, bent seat rails and bent seat
posts.

That's where I was coming from when I ordered my semi-custom FS - except for the
bent seatposts: Incremental changes over time.... wound up with the seat
waaaaay back. Rationalized it based on my size fifteen feet and very long legs.

When I tried riding the new bike, I was pleasantly surprised at how balanced it
felt over the bumps and how well it climbed.
--
PeteCresswell

Raptor wrote:

(PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Mark Hickey:
It's pretty much a given that you'll have to compromise if you are
going to ride your Rockhopper on the road and off the road
(particularly if "off the road" includes technical riding). The ideal
position for each type of riding is different, so one or both
positions will have to be a compromise.

Pete did a great job discussing the snipped bits... (annd no, I'm not
talking vasectomy...) ;-)

Riding half on the bar ends and half on the bars puts me back in the maker's
recommended position, holding the bars normally leaves me comfortable for
descents, and really getting out on the bar ends lets me go more aero that I'd
ever really want/need to.

I like it...

I just added bar ends to my bike, its only modification so far (other
than pushing the saddle back on the existing seat post). I haven't
ridden it since, so it could be that I can be happy by moving my hands
forward that couple of inches.

The other thing you might consider is an adjustable stem. Though
pretty much all of 'em are aimed at the road market (and thus have
26.0mm clamps) the Kalloy adjustable has a 25.4mm clamp, and is also
available with a 31.8mm clamp (some MTB bars now come in that spec).
Using this stem, it would be simple to set up a bike for both road and
off-road riding.

You'd simply set the stem at its lowest position for riding on the
road, then rotate it (way) up and back for off-road. To get an idea
of how much "up and back" you can move the bars with a given stem
angle, check out my stem angle chart at:

http://www.habcycles.com/fitting.html

The Kalloy adjustable stem (which is quite nice and still inexpensive)
has a range of 70 to 130 degrees, which on the chart (and on the bike)
would correspond to a range from flat (represented as the "starting
point" on the chart) to a little bit past the last (highest) line on
the chart... essentially, showing a range from the lowest, longest
"road position" to an "off-road" position with the bars about 4.5cm
(1-3/4") further back and 9cm (3-1/2") higher. In other words, the
11cm stem would give you the option of virtually all of the 11cm "way
points" on the chart.

The nice thing about adjusting the height with the adjustable stem is
that you don't have to mess around with the headset bearing preload
every time. You would have to rotate the bars if you went from one
extreme to the others unless you like your brake levers pointing up
pretty severely when riding off-road.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame