creation of the offence "culpable cycling"

"TimC" wrote:

But if it were ever to be used
for something stupid being done (running a red light), that didn't
then go onto create significant damage and/or injury, I'd be very
worried.

Culpable driving can only occur when a driver causes the death of someone,
as a result of the driver's gross negligence (culpability). Any culpable
driving offence would have to parallel this.

As much as people will say otherwise, breaking the law on a
bicycle very rarely has the impact that breaking the law in a car has
often enough. Doing something stupid on a bicycle is not as damaging
as doing something stupid in a car, and so doesn't have cause to
invoke as great a punitive/corrective wrath from society.

Yes, that's a concern I have. The culpability of cutting through a
pedestrian red light on a light bike has got to be very much less than the
culpbility of roaring through in a 4WD, or in a 10 tonne semitrailer,
surely.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

"PeteSig" wrote:

Culpable driving can only occur when a driver causes the death of someone,
as a result of the driver's gross negligence (culpability). Any culpable
driving offence would have to parallel this.

Make that 'any culpable cycling offence would have to parallel this' !!!

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

"AndrewJ" wrote in message
...

Yup. I like to think that the publicity might have helped to push this
along, but whatever.

I haven't heard about it. What happened?

In aus.bicycle on Fri, 7 Mar 2008 21:49:08 +1100
TimC wrote:

Zebee - remember that discussion about private mail at ork
addresses[1] in the Scary Devil Monastery? Given how close I've been
in the past to blacklisting gmail addresses in mail as well, I
consider the gmail POP solution particularly bad. They're the new
AOL.


I could simply change the address to my zip one, but I see no reason
to. If people nuclear killfile then they do. I have a fairly heavy
news habit and have had no reason to do something that silly.

It's just the address on the from line after all, which has nothing to
do with a references line, posting service or similar. Given how
trivial they are to change killfiling on that seems to be rather
luserish to me.

If sod+dog has a gmail address, I really couldn't give a damn. It
isn't like email addresses for most people are *real* or anything,
with all the munging going on.

Zebee

On 2008-03-07, Zebee Johnstone (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
I could simply change the address to my zip one, but I see no reason
to. If people nuclear killfile then they do. I have a fairly heavy
news habit and have had no reason to do something that silly.

It's just the address on the from line after all, which has nothing to
do with a references line, posting service or similar. Given how
trivial they are to change killfiling on that seems to be rather
luserish to me.

If sod+dog has a gmail address, I really couldn't give a damn. It
isn't like email addresses for most people are *real* or anything,
with all the munging going on.

Ah, hadn't noticed (hadn't looked) that you in particular weren't
posting through google, in which case my killing on the X-trace
wouldn't affect you. It would score Bleve though, so I'd have to
whitelist him.

--
TimC
Computer screens simply ooze buckets of yang.
To balance this, place some women around the corners of the room.
-- Kaz Cooke, Dumb Feng Shui

Zebee Johnstone wrote:



I could simply change the address to my zip one,

If zip gives you self set up, multiple email addresses, just set up a
munged or dated one for usenet. Throw it away when the spam gets too much.

In aus.bicycle on Sat, 08 Mar 2008 11:43:26 +1100
Terryc wrote:
Zebee Johnstone wrote:



I could simply change the address to my zip one,

If zip gives you self set up, multiple email addresses, just set up a
munged or dated one for usenet. Throw it away when the spam gets too much.

Nah, I have a bayesian filter that is very well trained on that
address.

I stopped using it when zip stopped having a shell server and I didn't
have a permanent IP so I couldn't use my own shell server.

ISP webmail is unusable because of spam, gmail's spam filter is very
good so I use gmail for an address I can get to from anywhere.

Finding a machine with ssh where I can safely attach the thumb drive
with my ssh key is harder...

Zebee

On Mar 8, 2:57 am, "Alan Erskine" wrote:
"AndrewJ" wrote in message

...

Yup. I like to think that the publicity might have helped to push this
along, but whatever.

I haven't heard about it. What happened?

It was in January. See original post. Doesn't bear too much
repetition, but it
was a real eye-opener for me to encounter the bicycle equivalent of
the crazy
car driver.

On Mar 7, 10:07 pm, TimC -
astro.swin.edu.au wrote:
On 2008-03-07, AndrewJ (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:



On Mar 7, 12:42 pm, cfsmtb cfsmtb.35v...@no-
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com wrote:
AndrewJ Wrote:

For what it's worth I'm not a troll. I'm not going to extol the
virtues of gmail,
as I'm also a google shareholder. I don't use my work email as I don't
want
to spend all weekend working replying to emails :-)

(Yes, it does look like a troll, but I can post the x-ray of my arm
if you want :-) )

And I've heard you being interviewed on Jon Faines show (ABC 774) about
the incident mentioned above, so you're obviously *not* a troll.

Yup. I like to think that the publicity might have helped to push this
along, but whatever.

I've gone from "I'm not sure if I'll ride again" to "when I ride
again". So I'm making progress :-)

Onya. For what it's worth, I knew you weren't a troll

I'm a little unsure as to why the offence is not amalgamated into the
culpable driving offence (I don't have the text of the culpable
driving offence at hand -- maybe it really can't fit). I believe I've
only ever heard "culpable driving" used in conjunction with "causing
injury|death" (this may be an artifact of a reporting bias in the
media - you don't hear about offences that don't result in injury -
because then you'd have 6502 stories on the news per night).

As such, this may not be a dangerous move -- culpable cycling causing
death *should* be quite a punishable offence, as long as it truly is
culpable (and we are yet to see whether that guy truly was stepping
off a stationary tram or whether he was darting across the road
between trams, illegally jaywalking). But if it were ever to be used
for something stupid being done (running a red light), that didn't
then go onto create significant damage and/or injury, I'd be very
worried. As much as people will say otherwise, breaking the law on a
bicycle very rarely has the impact that breaking the law in a car has
often enough. Doing something stupid on a bicycle is not as damaging
as doing something stupid in a car, and so doesn't have cause to
invoke as great a punitive/corrective wrath from society.

--
TimC cat ~/.signature

Passing cosmic ray (core dumped)


Yes, consider how many people are injured by encounters with bicycles
every year, compared with encounters with cars. It's nowhere near the
magnitude of the problem. But still it should not be possible to get
away
with (for example) running a red light through a pedestrian crossing
and
knocking a pedestrian to the ground with serious injuries. (Not in
reference
to any current case, I don't know the details sufficient to comment on
those).

On Mar 7, 6:40 am, wrote:
On Mar 6, 7:04 pm, John Tserkezis

wrote:
Alan Erskine wrote:
John; it's a gmail troll. Don't waste your breath.

Whoops, I normally filter out gmail accounts on all my newsgroups

Some of us don't have any other way to post :-(

So you post via Google Groups?

Then you'll want to install a Google Groups killfile script.

There are several available. Just Google for google groups killfile.

Travis
www.travismorien.com