Driver on drugs who mowed down group of cyclists while on wrong sideof road is jailed - LONG

On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.

I readily accept that such a description applies to people such as
yourself who have no regard or thought for the safety and welfare of
others, particularly pedestrians, but I do not accept that all cyclists
are as sociopathic as you (and some other cyclists here) are.

On Saturday, 12 September 2020 11:43:29 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.


How did you reach that conclusion?

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

On 12/09/2020 13:20, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 11:43:29 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.


How did you reach that conclusion?

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

Both were illegal, but lots of people might be able to recount having
once cycled - or seen someone cycle - along a short part of a footway in
order to get past a very specific obstruction such as the aftermath of
an accident, or indeed, a flood. Provided that the action was carried
out slowly and safely, giving due precedence to the lawful users of the
footway, most of us would be able to rationalise such a thing in those
specific circumstances. The same might well be true in circumstances
where traffic lights are stuck (which used to happen more frequently
than it seems happens today. And of course, those sorts of specific
situations also apply to everything from a moped to a delivery tanker.

But that is not the only circumstances in which you have illegally
cycled along footways or broken the law with respect to traffic lights.
You don't even have an emergency to plead in the case of the "temp
roadworks". You just decided that you weren't going to wait.

Of course, you have disregarded both of those laws - and others - many
times, more or less every time you cycle anywhere. How would anyone know
that? Easy - you're a cyclist. Some cyclists - a monority of them -
*can* be observed to be law-abiding and reasonable, but assume that a
cyclist is a scofflaw chav and you'll be right far more often than
you'll be wrong.

On Saturday, September 12, 2020 at 1:20:14 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

Have you ever done any of these illegal acts though?

Such as:
Speeding, parking the wrong way at night, on yellow lines, on zig zags, outside schools, pavement parking, obstructing traffic by inconsiderate parking, driving while drunk, on mobile phones, with no car tax, no licence, no insurance, no MOT, illegal plates, overtaking on double lines, due care, bald tyres, faulty brakes, one eyed monsters, no rear lights, no brake lights, no indicators, fog light abuse, faulty steering, windscreen obscuration, darkly tinted windows, child seat abuse, no seatbelts, insecure load, one way street abuse, amber/red light jumping, cycle box abuse, bus lane abuse, box junction abuse, death by dangerous driving, excess smoke and noise from exhaust, duff suspension, leaking oil, cash for crash fiddles, underage child in front, lights causing glare, over weight limit, ignoring no entry signs, parking without permit, not having control of your vehicle, improper use of horn, using horn at night, no in date photo licence, no licence application after long ban, without prescribed eyewear, failing to stop for police/lollipop/zebra etc - ran out of space.

On Saturday, 12 September 2020 14:28:34 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 13:20, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 11:43:29 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.


How did you reach that conclusion?

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

Both were illegal, but lots of people might be able to recount having
once cycled - or seen someone cycle - along a short part of a footway in
order to get past a very specific obstruction such as the aftermath of
an accident, or indeed, a flood. Provided that the action was carried
out slowly and safely, giving due precedence to the lawful users of the
footway, most of us would be able to rationalise such a thing in those
specific circumstances. The same might well be true in circumstances
where traffic lights are stuck (which used to happen more frequently
than it seems happens today. And of course, those sorts of specific
situations also apply to everything from a moped to a delivery tanker.

But that is not the only circumstances in which you have illegally
cycled along footways or broken the law with respect to traffic lights.
You don't even have an emergency to plead in the case of the "temp
roadworks". You just decided that you weren't going to wait.

Of course, you have disregarded both of those laws - and others - many
times, more or less every time you cycle anywhere. How would anyone know
that? Easy - you're a cyclist. Some cyclists - a monority of them -
*can* be observed to be law-abiding and reasonable, but assume that a
cyclist is a scofflaw chav and you'll be right far more often than
you'll be wrong.

Finally you grasp the difference between law and legislative intent.

On 12/09/2020 14:52, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 14:28:34 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 13:20, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 11:43:29 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.


How did you reach that conclusion?

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

Both were illegal, but lots of people might be able to recount having
once cycled - or seen someone cycle - along a short part of a footway in
order to get past a very specific obstruction such as the aftermath of
an accident, or indeed, a flood. Provided that the action was carried
out slowly and safely, giving due precedence to the lawful users of the
footway, most of us would be able to rationalise such a thing in those
specific circumstances. The same might well be true in circumstances
where traffic lights are stuck (which used to happen more frequently
than it seems happens today. And of course, those sorts of specific
situations also apply to everything from a moped to a delivery tanker.

But that is not the only circumstances in which you have illegally
cycled along footways or broken the law with respect to traffic lights.
You don't even have an emergency to plead in the case of the "temp
roadworks". You just decided that you weren't going to wait.

Of course, you have disregarded both of those laws - and others - many
times, more or less every time you cycle anywhere. How would anyone know
that? Easy - you're a cyclist. Some cyclists - a monority of them -
*can* be observed to be law-abiding and reasonable, but assume that a
cyclist is a scofflaw chav and you'll be right far more often than
you'll be wrong.

Finally you grasp the difference between law and legislative intent.

When the law against the use of carriages on footways was introduced,
there was no legislative intent to allow cyclists to cycle along them.

When traffic lights were introduced (and the law was amended so as to
give them legal effect), there was no legislative intent that they
should not apply to cyclists.

The legislative intent was that cyclists should not cycle along footways
and that they should stop and wait at red traffic lights.

Of course, extreme emergency sometimes necessitates things that people
wouldn't usually do (though whether than can be truly said to apply to
cyclists, who *do* usually cycle on footways and through red traffic
lights, in everyday non-emergency situations, is rather more debatable).

Even you knew that.

On Saturday, 12 September 2020 15:04:55 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 14:52, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 14:28:34 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 13:20, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 11:43:29 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 03:30, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 02:46:08 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 05/09/2020 21:35, Mike Collins wrote:
On Thursday, 3 September 2020 15:08:07 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:

I give you a 100% guarantee that I have never driven a car - or ridden a
bicycle - along a footway


I can give you a 100% guarantee I have never crashed a B747 because I have never flown a B747.

What a shame it is that you cannot (honestly) give a guarantee that you
have never ridden a bicycle along a footway.

I have ridden a bicycle on the footway. I have also ridden my bicycle through a red light, once in front of a Police car.

The fact that you are not old enough to drive or intelligent enough to cycle will not surprise any one on this group.

The only sensible implication of what you admit is that all cyclists
break the law every time they go out on their bikes and are all scofflaw
chavs.


How did you reach that conclusion?

I once cycled about 100 yards along the footway because the carriageway was flooded, no pedestrians were endangered.
I once cycled through a red light at temp roadworks, inside the cones, which put no one in danger and helped subsidised traffic flow.

Both were illegal, but lots of people might be able to recount having
once cycled - or seen someone cycle - along a short part of a footway in
order to get past a very specific obstruction such as the aftermath of
an accident, or indeed, a flood. Provided that the action was carried
out slowly and safely, giving due precedence to the lawful users of the
footway, most of us would be able to rationalise such a thing in those
specific circumstances. The same might well be true in circumstances
where traffic lights are stuck (which used to happen more frequently
than it seems happens today. And of course, those sorts of specific
situations also apply to everything from a moped to a delivery tanker.

But that is not the only circumstances in which you have illegally
cycled along footways or broken the law with respect to traffic lights.
You don't even have an emergency to plead in the case of the "temp
roadworks". You just decided that you weren't going to wait.

Of course, you have disregarded both of those laws - and others - many
times, more or less every time you cycle anywhere. How would anyone know
that? Easy - you're a cyclist. Some cyclists - a monority of them -
*can* be observed to be law-abiding and reasonable, but assume that a
cyclist is a scofflaw chav and you'll be right far more often than
you'll be wrong.

Finally you grasp the difference between law and legislative intent.

When the law against the use of carriages on footways was introduced,

That would be the 1835 Highways Act.

there was no legislative intent to allow cyclists to cycle along them.

https://swarb.co.uk/taylor-v-goodwin-qbd-1879/



When traffic lights were introduced

Their purpose was to manage traffic flow and had nothing to do with safety.

I am sure someone will post an example but I have never seen traffic light on a cycle way. Probably because cyclists are more intelligent than motorists.

On 12/09/2020 15:20, Mike Collins wrote:
On Saturday, 12 September 2020 15:04:55 UTC+1, JNugent wrote:
On 12/09/2020 14:52, Mike Collins wrote:

Finally you grasp the difference between law and legislative
intent.

I really doubt it.

When the law against the use of carriages on footways was
introduced,

That would be the 1835 Highways Act.

I expect the legal gods that Nugent worships knew all about future
inventions.

there was no legislative intent to allow cyclists to cycle along
them.

I have a copy of the first Highway Code. Nowhere does it mention
pavements except to tell pedestrians to "never walk on the carriageway
where there is a pavement".
https://swarb.co.uk/taylor-v-goodwin-qbd-1879/

When traffic lights were introduced

Their purpose was to manage traffic flow and had nothing to do with
safety.

The same Highway Code says that section 49 of the Road Traffic Act 1930
made it an offence to disobey the indications given by traffic lights.
Since the first traffic light was installed in London in 1868 (non-lit
signals have a much longer history), I expect it took a good number of
careful, law abiding motorists to kill people before the law caught up.