Bicyclists going wrong way and other crimes

On 07 Aug 2004 04:48:06 GMT, Hunrobe wrote:

Bill Baka

wrote in part:

Yes, we need more hills. Let's put it on the Democrats agenda,

Careful, Bill. It is an election year after all. Some politician *will*
promise
it only to break the promise after being elected... and after
commissioning an
expensive feasibility study... paid for with tax money... paid to his
brother-in-law's cousin's neighbor's best friend's company... who were
major
contributors to his campaign.

Regards,
Bob Hunt


Well maybe, they are politicians, after all, so we must realize their
limitations.
At least they are trying to look athletic, even if it is only good for
laughs.
I would just love it if one was elected on actual brains.
I'm dreaming again.
Bill Baka


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Bill Baka

wrote:

Well maybe, they are politicians, after all, so we must realize their
limitations.
At least they are trying to look athletic, even if it is only good for
laughs.
I would just love it if one was elected on actual brains.
I'm dreaming again.

Some wisdom is timeless.

"Dear reader,
Suppose you are an idiot. Now suppose you are a member of Congress. But I
repeat myself."- Mark Twain

My apologies to Mr. Twain if that's not an exact quote. It's too late to look
it up and I know I have the gist right.

Regards,
Bob Hunt

In article ,
(Hunrobe) wrote:

Bill Baka

wrote:

Well maybe, they are politicians, after all, so we must realize their
limitations.
At least they are trying to look athletic, even if it is only good for
laughs.
I would just love it if one was elected on actual brains.
I'm dreaming again.

Some wisdom is timeless.

"Dear reader,
Suppose you are an idiot. Now suppose you are a member of Congress. But I
repeat myself."- Mark Twain

My apologies to Mr. Twain if that's not an exact quote. It's too late to look
it up and I know I have the gist right.

Regards,
Bob Hunt

Good one!

....but the real idiots are those of us who vote these fools into office, or not.

HAND

--
³Freedom Is a Light for Which Many Have Died in Darkness³

- Tomb of the unknown - American Revolution

This looks like a double post but it is because it seems to never have
gotten past my local server.
Bill
On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 00:43:18 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 05:32:58 GMT, Chris BeHanna
wrote:

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 21:50:10 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 05:12:42 GMT, Claire Petersky
wrote:

"Bill Baka" wrote in message
news Can we just
let this thread die?

Bill, probably every experienced cyclist has had the experience of
dealing with wrong-way cyclists. It is very frustrating, because we
know what they are doing is very dangerous, and everyone's going
too fast to have a decent conversation about how mistaken they are
to bicycle the wrong way. We are persistent here because we are all
actually sitting at desks and not on bikes. For once, we can grab
the wrong-way cyclist by the shoulders and shout, "Don't do that!
It's really, really dumb!"

I prediction no one's going to give up on this thread until you
either are quiet or agree with us.

I never really disagreed, I just mentioned that there was one
segment of road that has such crummy conditions that some times I
ride on the wrong side. One road! Bad road. No bicycle lane.
Rednecks. Only 1 car per minute.

After having argued this a bit, I must concede that there are some
roads where it might possibly make sense to do what you're doing. The
fact that you know that riding wrong way is generally undesirable, and
that you don't do it anywhere else but on this one section, means that
you deserve some slack, IMHO. That DJT fool, OTOH, ....

Thanks for that.
I rode into one other thing in town and traffic that actually caused me
to dismount, traffic and bad road design. Marysville, Ca.
Hwy.65 coming into town at rush hour. No consideration for bikes at all.

There's one short stretch on my "hill loop", in fact: the right
side of the road (rural, lane-and-a-half-with-not-even-a-stripe-down-
the-center) is in *such* ****ty condition as to be impassable on
a road bike at any decent speed. This is a short, straight section
with a long sightline. I ride wrong-way to get around the lunar
surface portion of the road, do a head check, and then get back to
where I should be.

I see you use the "Loop" concept as well. My around the block is just
a bit over 6 miles at about 24 minutes average. Did ten in one day for
a 60 mile total with the house and food every 6 miles, so
kind of cheating. Country side has no blocks, so take them as you can.
No hills to attack though, they are a 20 mile ride to get to.
Beale AFB is between me and the fun stuff.

I wouldn't ride it at all, but the rolling terrain provides a
great "bicycle fartlek" workout.

Yes, we need more hills. Let's put it on the Democrats agenda,
"More hills, more bikes."
Bill Baka





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On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 20:57:35 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

Time for me to put my foot in my mouth again with the bicycle group.
All this stuff about reaction time is pretty irrelevant if you
are not looking in the rear view mirror all the time. It is just
the way it is that you will see somthing in front of you and react
to it, but an image in a mirror doesn't impact the brain the same
way.

It's not just about reaction time. If I'm riding with traffic,
vehicles coming up behind me are not surprised by my presence and all
they have to do is *adjust* their speed to avoid any conflict. If I'm
riding against traffic, then I'm in an area where drivers are most
certainly not expecting me to be and when they do notice me, it's a
far more dramatic adjustment of their speed (complete stop or a sudden
maneuver, complicated by surprise) to compensate for my being there.

Wrong way riding? No thanks.
--
Brandon Sommerville (remove ".gov" to e-mail)

"Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are
we," Bush said. "They never stop thinking about new ways
to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."

-GWB while signing the Department of Defense Appropriations Act of 2005

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:20:11 -0400, Brandon Sommerville
wrote:

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 20:57:35 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

Time for me to put my foot in my mouth again with the bicycle group.
All this stuff about reaction time is pretty irrelevant if you
are not looking in the rear view mirror all the time. It is just
the way it is that you will see somthing in front of you and react
to it, but an image in a mirror doesn't impact the brain the same
way.

It's not just about reaction time. If I'm riding with traffic,
vehicles coming up behind me are not surprised by my presence and all
they have to do is *adjust* their speed to avoid any conflict. If I'm
riding against traffic, then I'm in an area where drivers are most
certainly not expecting me to be and when they do notice me, it's a
far more dramatic adjustment of their speed (complete stop or a sudden
maneuver, complicated by surprise) to compensate for my being there.

Wrong way riding? No thanks.

Try this.
Safe way to ride, wrong way or not.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_right.jpg

Right way to ride, but suicidal.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_wrong.jpg
Anybody who wishes to ride this road by the book,
please let me know where to send the flowers.

Really wrong way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_wrong.jpg

Really right way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_right.jpg

Get the point?
Some conditions require just a bit of thinking outside the box.
Better alive than dead and legal.
Bill Baka



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On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 07:12:23 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

Try this.
Safe way to ride, wrong way or not.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_right.jpg

Right way to ride, but suicidal.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_wrong.jpg
Anybody who wishes to ride this road by the book,
please let me know where to send the flowers.

Really wrong way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_wrong.jpg

Really right way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_right.jpg

Get the point?
Some conditions require just a bit of thinking outside the box.
Better alive than dead and legal.

I agree with this statement 100%, but without physically being at the
road, I'll reserve judgement on it.
--
Brandon Sommerville (remove ".gov" to e-mail)

"Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are
we," Bush said. "They never stop thinking about new ways
to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."

-GWB while signing the Department of Defense Appropriations Act of 2005

In rec.bicycles.misc Bill Baka wrote:
Try this.
Safe way to ride, wrong way or not.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_right.jpg

Right way to ride, but suicidal.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_wrong.jpg
Anybody who wishes to ride this road by the book,
please let me know where to send the flowers.

Really wrong way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_wrong.jpg

Really right way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_right.jpg

Get the point?
Some conditions require just a bit of thinking outside the box.
Better alive than dead and legal.

that is what you're so concerned about? so you advocate riding into traffic
whenever the sun is in your eyes and there's no shoulder? bill, did you hit
your head getting off the short bus .. that would describe half my rides.
you're grossly overstating your case.
--
david reuteler

Bill Baka wrote:

Try this.
Safe way to ride, wrong way or not.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_right.jpg

Right way to ride, but suicidal.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_wrong.jpg
Anybody who wishes to ride this road by the book,
please let me know where to send the flowers.

Really wrong way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_wrong.jpg

Really right way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_right.jpg

Get the point?
Some conditions require just a bit of thinking outside the box.
Better alive than dead and legal.

Bill, I got the point a long time ago. I can also now say that I regularly
ride on a road that looks just like this. I wouldn't dare ride it on the
left, even with the solar glare you photographed. It really is too
dangerous.

I ride it at 15-20 MPH, on the right, about 3 feet to the left of the white
line (where the dark pavement is from passenger side car tires).

It really is safer that way.

Oh, and the road has a 55 MPH speed limit, which means traffic is going from
55 to 70 MPH.

There's plenty of time to be seen, even with the glare. I've never had a
single close call.

Austin

Bill Baka wrote:
On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:20:11 -0400, Brandon Sommerville
wrote:

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 20:57:35 -0700, Bill Baka wrote:

Time for me to put my foot in my mouth again with the bicycle group.
All this stuff about reaction time is pretty irrelevant if you
are not looking in the rear view mirror all the time.

You don't need to look in the mirror "all the time." You check it as
often as necessary. Cars don't approach at infinite speed. If you see
thirty seconds worth of empty road behind you, then you can check again
in, oh, 25 seconds.


It is just
the way it is that you will see somthing in front of you and react
to it, but an image in a mirror doesn't impact the brain the same
way.

?? If you're so worried about oncoming traffic that you violate the
most fundamental rule of the road, I'd think you'd be motivated to pay
attention to the mirror. I'd think the image _would_ "impact your brain."


Try this.
Safe way to ride, wrong way or not.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_right.jpg

Right way to ride, but suicidal.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_wrong.jpg
Anybody who wishes to ride this road by the book,
please let me know where to send the flowers.

Really wrong way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/wrong_wrong.jpg

Really right way to ride.
http://www.syix.com/bbaka/bike/right_right.jpg

Get the point?
Some conditions require just a bit of thinking outside the box.
Better alive than dead and legal.
Bill Baka

I think your point is: direction of the sun is more important than
proper direction on the road.

I still don't buy it. For one thing, although the lens flare in your
second picture looks impressive, the effect on the human eye is much,
much less. Anyone who knows anything about photography knows that film
is much less adaptable than the human eye; we can easily see things that
we can capture on film only with difficulty. Besides, drivers have
visors in their cars for just this purpose.

If we start complicating the rules of the road as you propose - "Ride on
the right, except when you think drivers may see you better on the left"
- the can of worms is going to be smelly indeed. What happens when two
cyclists have different judgments about where they should be riding?
How do motorists avoid both a left side and a right side cyclist? What
happens if a wrong-way cyclist gets distracted and doesn't notice an
oncoming car? How does the right side cyclist handle the oncoming
turkey who thinks it's too dangerous to ride properly?

In my experience, the "dangerous" sunlight that you fear is not a
problem unless the sun is _extremely_ low in the sky and perfectly
aligned with the road on a day with no clouds. That means it's just for
a few minutes on a few days of the year. If you need a legal technique
to handle your fears, try these: a) Stay off that road at those
uncommon times. b) Get a rear view mirror and pull off the road when
traffic approaches from the rear.

The latter makes the most sense to me. Mirrors are handy for lots of
reasons, and you're having to pull off the road anyway, riding on the
left as you do. My way is legal, it endangers no other cyclists, and it
does not promote one of the most common causes of car-bike crashes.


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