Scientific American does bicycle helmets

wrote:
: IOW, there's only one cyclist in all these photographs:
: http://www.domela.com/photos_people/...eview_2006.pdf

May be only one cyclist there, but I see two crazy people...

Cathy Kearns wrote:
:: "Gooserider" wrote in message
:: ...
:::
::: "Cathy Kearns" wrote in message
::: . ..
::::
:::: "Gooserider" wrote in message
:::: ...
:::::
::::: "Roger Zoul" wrote in message
::::: ...
::::::
:::::: "Gooserider" wrote
:::::::
::::::: ---Then there are the people who have had a helmet take an
::::::: impact and believe they were saved by said helmet. No study
::::::: will convince me that the truck mirror which cracked my helmet
::::::: at 20mph would have had no effect on my naked skull. :-)
::::::
:::::: I would say that your's is a case where the helmet probably did
:::::: help. But then again, you weren't sliding across the pavement
:::::: with your helmet in contact with a rough surface. That situation
:::::: is less clear cut.
:::::
::::: Probably? How about conceding that taking a truck mirror impact
::::: to my naked skull would DEFINTELY caused me injury?
::::
:::: I'm guessing he went for probably because it's also slightly
:::: possible that withouth the extra 2 inches around your head the
:::: truck mirror would have missed entirely. I stoke on a tandem. My
:::: helmet is very useful for the times my captain ducks without
:::: telling me, and a branch hits my helmet. I'm thinking otherwise
:::: the branch would grab my hair, and yeah, that would hurt. (And I
:::: happen to love the captain, so occasionally uncalled branches are
:::: just part of life.)
::::
:::
::: He hit me at the 6 o'clock position on the helmet. Right above the
::: brain stem. Your assumption isn't correct.
::
:: Ahh, additional information is always helpful.

Ok, so it's very likely that the helmet saved your life. Ok. Still, that's
a very unlikely thing to have happen, even on a bike.

Gooserider wrote:

Ok, so it's very likely that the helmet saved your life. Ok. Still,
that's a very unlikely thing to have happen, even on a bike.

It didn't necessariy save my life, but it definitely prevented me from
having a serious injury. I was hit, started to flip, lost consciousness, and
woke up to a bunch of people amazed I was alive. I'm pretty surprised I
didn't end up with a broken neck or a concussion.


I remember your original account. Glad it turned out as well as it did
for you.

"Bill Sornson" wrote in message
...
Roger Zoul wrote:
Cathy Kearns wrote:
"Gooserider" wrote in message
...

"Cathy Kearns" wrote in message
. ..

"Gooserider" wrote in message
...

"Roger Zoul" wrote in message
...

"Gooserider" wrote

---Then there are the people who have had a helmet take an
impact and believe they were saved by said helmet. No study
will convince me that the truck mirror which cracked my helmet
at 20mph would have had no effect on my naked skull. :-)

I would say that your's is a case where the helmet probably did
help. But then again, you weren't sliding across the pavement
with your helmet in contact with a rough surface. That situation
is less clear cut.

Probably? How about conceding that taking a truck mirror impact
to my naked skull would DEFINTELY caused me injury?

I'm guessing he went for probably because it's also slightly
possible that withouth the extra 2 inches around your head the
truck mirror would have missed entirely. I stoke on a tandem. My
helmet is very useful for the times my captain ducks without
telling me, and a branch hits my helmet. I'm thinking otherwise
the branch would grab my hair, and yeah, that would hurt. (And I
happen to love the captain, so occasionally uncalled branches are
just part of life.)


He hit me at the 6 o'clock position on the helmet. Right above the
brain stem. Your assumption isn't correct.

Ahh, additional information is always helpful.

Ok, so it's very likely that the helmet saved your life. Ok. Still,
that's a very unlikely thing to have happen, even on a bike.

He didn't say it saved his life; he said it almost certainly prevented
serious injury.


Any accident that "almost certainly prevented serious injury" almost
certainly has the potential to end one's life.

As for the unlikely part, I've had right-side rear view mirrors come very
close to hitting me numerous times. I'd guess that it's a fairly common
cause of cyclist injury -- from quite minor to severe.

Well, this is the only time I've heard of an actual injury here.

"Gooserider" wrote in message
...

"Roger Zoul" wrote in message
...
Cathy Kearns wrote:
:: "Gooserider" wrote in message
:: ...
:::
::: "Cathy Kearns" wrote in message
::: . ..
::::
:::: "Gooserider" wrote in message
:::: ...
:::::
::::: "Roger Zoul" wrote in message
::::: ...
::::::
:::::: "Gooserider" wrote
:::::::
::::::: ---Then there are the people who have had a helmet take an
::::::: impact and believe they were saved by said helmet. No study
::::::: will convince me that the truck mirror which cracked my helmet
::::::: at 20mph would have had no effect on my naked skull. :-)
::::::
:::::: I would say that your's is a case where the helmet probably did
:::::: help. But then again, you weren't sliding across the pavement
:::::: with your helmet in contact with a rough surface. That situation
:::::: is less clear cut.
:::::
::::: Probably? How about conceding that taking a truck mirror impact
::::: to my naked skull would DEFINTELY caused me injury?
::::
:::: I'm guessing he went for probably because it's also slightly
:::: possible that withouth the extra 2 inches around your head the
:::: truck mirror would have missed entirely. I stoke on a tandem. My
:::: helmet is very useful for the times my captain ducks without
:::: telling me, and a branch hits my helmet. I'm thinking otherwise
:::: the branch would grab my hair, and yeah, that would hurt. (And I
:::: happen to love the captain, so occasionally uncalled branches are
:::: just part of life.)
::::
:::
::: He hit me at the 6 o'clock position on the helmet. Right above the
::: brain stem. Your assumption isn't correct.
::
:: Ahh, additional information is always helpful.

Ok, so it's very likely that the helmet saved your life. Ok. Still,
that's a very unlikely thing to have happen, even on a bike.
It didn't necessariy save my life, but it definitely prevented me from
having a serious injury.

Any serious head injury could result in loss of life.

I was hit, started to flip, lost consciousness, and woke up to a bunch of
people amazed I was alive.

Rightly so.


I'm pretty surprised I didn't end up with a broken neck or a concussion.

On Oct 4, 3:38 am, "Mike Kruger" wrote:
Dennis P. Harris wrote:
On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 00:39:44 GMT in rec.bicycles.misc, "Mike
Kruger" wrote:

it's interesting because of the headline switch and the fact that
the helmet debate makes it into a general interest publication.

Uh... Scientific American *is* a general interest publication.
Always has been. It's certainly not a peer reviewed journal.

I write it's in Scientific American, meaning the helmet debate made it into
a general interest publication.
You correct me by noting that Scientific American is a general interest
publication.

????

Beautiful!

Bill "Sorni" Sornson wrote:
On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 11:08:46 -0000, landotter
wrote:
On Oct 3, 2:03 am, (Dennis P. Harris)
wrote:

IMHO folks who don't wear helmets don't have much to protect.

Ahhhh, here comes the self righteous ad hominem blanket attack
without any evidence. You might do better with a plain penis pump.

Just remember, the vast majority of riders on the planet think you're
a cocksucker.

A rather vanilla comment draws a vile invective, including the latter (rat)
accusing the former of ad hominem! Classic hypocrisy, rudeness and
classlessness.

Doesn't get much better LOL

Earth to Planet Sorni - Dennis P. Harris started with the insults.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
A Real Cyclist [TM] keeps at least one bicycle in the bedroom.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Ozark - 100% Service and 0% "Attitude" -Bicycle wrote:
On Oct 3, 12:05 pm, wrote:
On Oct 2, 7:39 pm, "Mike Kruger" wrote:

From the October 2007 Scientific American in print,
Do Helmets Attract Cars to Cyclists?
and on the web hehttp://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?art...2-99DF-3594A60...
Strange but True: Helmets Attract Cars to Cyclists
(note the different headlines!)
This is by a reporter, not a scientist, and cites the following:
1. Ian Walker's study showing helmets attract cars to cyclists (anti-helmet)
2. Randy Swart, founder of the Bicycle Helmet Safety Institute (pro-helmet)
3. Dorothy Robinson's work showing mandatory helmet laws "did not have a significant effect on bicycle accidents resulting in head injuries" (anti-helmet)
4. New York City report showing that of the 225 cyclists dying between 1996 and 2005 on NYC streets, 97% were not wearing helmets. (pro-helmet)
It ends in a wishy-washy manner:
"Walker, whose much-publicized report may inspire a new generation of bareheaded riders, won't make any specific recommendations to other cyclists (and neither will Scientific American), though he notes that when it comes to riding in traffic, motorists are the real problem. "If people read the research and decide a helmet makes them safer, they should wear one; if they read the research and decide it doesn't, perhaps they don't need to," Walker says, adding the caveat, "But they do need to read the research!" And watch out for cars."
It's not apparent in the web version, but this column is called "Fact or Fiction" and designed for "investigations into popular myths". For example, the July column definitely concluded that premium gas is useless for standard cars.
This isn't of interest because it provides new information; it's interesting because of the headline switch and the fact that the helmet debate makes it into a general interest publication.
OK folks, another helmet thread! How many posts will this one go? 200,
300, 400, more? Hell, Frank and Bill ought to be worth about 30 posts
apiece.

Unless some idiot cross posts it to URC, then the band of Limey idiots
(Chapman, Raven et al) will chime in with their paranoid rantings.
That's another few hundred worthless wastes of space. :-(

Now that you mention it, storage is inexpensive these days.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
A Real Cyclist [TM] keeps at least one bicycle in the bedroom.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Bill Sornson wrote:
Tom "Johnny Sunset" Sherman wrote:
Bill "Sorni" Sornson wrote:
On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 11:08:46 -0000, landotter
wrote:
On Oct 3, 2:03 am, (Dennis P. Harris)
wrote:
IMHO folks who don't wear helmets don't have much to protect.
Ahhhh, here comes the self righteous ad hominem blanket attack
without any evidence. You might do better with a plain penis pump.

Just remember, the vast majority of riders on the planet think
you're a cocksucker.
A rather vanilla comment draws a vile invective, including the
latter (rat) accusing the former of ad hominem! Classic hypocrisy,
rudeness and classlessness.

Doesn't get much better LOL

Earth to Planet Sorni - Dennis P. Harris started with the insults.

He said something mildly insulting (it's still at the top of this...see?).
For that he was called a cocksucker -- ironic, considering the source.

The "source"? Citation, please.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
A Real Cyclist [TM] keeps at least one bicycle in the bedroom.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

in message , Tom "Johnny
Sunset" Sherman ') wrote:

Ozark - 100% Service and 0% "Attitude" -Bicycle wrote:
On Oct 3, 12:05 pm, wrote:
On Oct 2, 7:39 pm, "Mike Kruger" wrote:

From the October 2007 Scientific American in print,
Do Helmets Attract Cars to Cyclists?
OK folks, another helmet thread! How many posts will this one go? 200,
300, 400, more? Hell, Frank and Bill ought to be worth about 30 posts
apiece.

Unless some idiot cross posts it to URC, then the band of Limey idiots
(Chapman, Raven et al) will chime in with their paranoid rantings.
That's another few hundred worthless wastes of space. :-(

Now that you mention it, storage is inexpensive these days.

And there seems a near-endless supply of bridges for trolls to hide under.
Do IKEA sell troll-bridges these days? And if so, have trolls evolved to
be clever enough to assemble them?

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; all in all you're just another click in the call
;; -- Minke Bouyed