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  #31  
Old January 22nd 21, 02:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 13,447
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On 1/21/2021 6:19 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 12:11:14 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/


:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


I vaguely recall that Mythbuseters or someone on YouTube tried the
fish in a barrel or swimming pool using a .22 revolver. The water
slowed the bullet down to almost a stop after a few inches. Some
bullets bounced off the fish. When they switched to a higher power
rifle, they couldn't hit the fish because of parallax at the water/air
boundary. Also the spinning bullet didn't go through the water in a
straight line.

Also, the criteria that Statista cites for a farm follows the IRS
definition of being able to use cash accounting on taxes instead of
accrual accounting. Lots of other benefits to being a farmer:
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/ten-helpful-tips-for-farm-tax-returns
My guess(tm) is that they used the UDA numbers:
Farms and Land in Farms 2019 Summary, February 2020
https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publications/Todays_Reports/reports/fnlo0220.pdf
To many wealthy individuals, the benefits of being able to deduct
income when it is received, rather than when the income is billed, is
substantial. The result are large numbers of small "farms" where the
major product grown are tax deductions. If I remove such tax farms
from the list of farms, the average size of farms that actually
produce something that can be eaten, is rather large. It certainly
will be larger than 40 acres.

It would be interesting to know the median size of US farms:
Farm Size and the Organization of U.S. Crop Farming (2013)
https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/publications/45108/39359_err152.pdf
The midpoint acreage for U.S. cropland nearly doubled
between 1982 and 2007, from 589 acres to 1,105.
Looks like the conglomerates and corporate farms are growing.

How to Use a Small Farm for Tax Write Offs
https://smallbusiness.chron.com/use-small-farm-tax-write-offs-15880.html

For entertainment, you might enjoy comparing where the fishing fleets
are actually fishing, versus the boundary lines around protected
areas.
https://globalfishingwatch.org
https://globalfishingwatch.org/map/
Zoom in on the Galapagos Islands for a good example of violations of a
protected zone. That's small pickings compared to what's now
happening off the coast of Peru in the last 30 days. By clicking on
the "1 month", you can extend the time to "3 months" to see the real
mess or drag the white dots for up to 1 year. Yep, fish farming is
big business until we kill off all the fish.




Yes the fish in barrel sounds right. In water you want a
'bang stick' or dynamite. Very effective in open water
although it would probably just split a barrel (and kill or
stun all the fish).

It's more complex than 'corporate farming'. My girlfriend's
farm at 120 hilly acres (not all tillable or even pasture)
supported her ancestors' large families from the 1830s
through the 1970s but a gazillion factors make that a losing
proposition now. Although she rents two fields and a pasture
to cover the County tax, her area is rapidly depopulating as
100~150 acres is not enough to live on now. There's
regulatory structural drag (milk license is seriously
expensive), farm equipment is large and very expensive with
high built-in maintenance costs[1] and more.

[1] Eastern European pirate software sells to US farmers to
flash their farm equipment after on-farm oil changes which
saves an expensive trip to the dealership. Only one example.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


Ads
  #32  
Old January 22nd 21, 02:31 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Posts: 2,196
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/

:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


If you had even a passing clue what you were talking about you would probably stop sucking Slocumb off. https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg It should come as no surprise that a mechanical engineer who taught does even have a passing understanding of statistics. Maybe you should ooo and ahhhh Slocumb who worked on bombers that were never used as bombers.
  #33  
Old January 22nd 21, 03:37 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On 1/21/2021 8:31 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/

:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


If you had even a passing clue what you were talking about you would probably stop sucking Slocumb off. https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg It should come as no surprise that a mechanical engineer who taught does even have a passing understanding of statistics.


OK,Tom, use that table and compute your estimate for the mean acreage of
a California farm, and of a U.S. farm. Tell us your answers and show
your work. I'm very curious how you get an answer of 40 acres.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #34  
Old January 22nd 21, 03:40 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
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Posts: 5,697
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 17:31:43 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/

:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


If you had even a passing clue what you were talking about you would probably stop sucking Slocumb off. https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg It should come as no surprise that a mechanical engineer who taught does even have a passing understanding of statistics. Maybe you should ooo and ahhhh Slocumb who worked on bombers that were never used as bombers.


https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/
https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publicatio...s/fnlo0220.pdf
https://www.infoplease.com/business/...ze-farm-united

But I don't suppose that you will bother to actually read, even a USDA
report... after all the gommunt don' now notting. Do it?

--
Cheers,

John B.

  #35  
Old January 22nd 21, 04:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
News 2021
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 281
Default OT: tommy Knows a Farmer, but didn't learn from it. Bike shops,rules, principles and law

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 17:22:19 -0800, Tom Kunich scribed:

On Wednesday, January 20, 2021 at 9:57:27 PM UTC-8, News 2021 wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:03:18 -0800, Tom Kunich scribed:
On Wednesday, January 20, 2021 at 3:20:00 PM UTC-8,
wrote:
On Monday, January 18, 2021 at 1:48:10 PM UTC-6,
wrote:
It certainly appears to be painful to you that people know
anything you don't. You probably go down to the market and tell
the farmers what the price of their goods are.
Oh my. I'm guessing you are talking about these things called
"farmer's markets" that are common in big cities. No farmer who owns
and works on a farm uses these terms like you just did. A farmer is
someone who grows corn or soybeans on hundreds/thousands of acres.
He tills, plants, combines the crops. And when a farmer talks about
markets, he is specifically referring to the Chicago Board of Trade
price for corn and soybeans. And he will call his local grain
elevator to get the spot price for the grain locally. And this idea
of going to the "farmer's market" to buy vegetables and other
nonsense, would be very alien to an old time farmer. He had a
vegetable garden near the house. He grew his own vegetables in his
garden. He did not go to the downtown of a big city and buy
vegetables from a "farmer" standing on a concrete city block who
trucked the vegetables in.
Russell, my cousins are farmers, why don't you tell them that they
don't use the terms I do? Why don't you tell lettuce farmers, tomato
farmers and beet farmers that they aren't farmers but gardeners?

That ia correct, they classify themselves as 'market gardeners' to
differentiate from the cropper/grain farmers and the graziers. Then
their are orchardists who grow fruit.

But Russel is right, those city 'market farmers' are really just
'shopkeepers' who buy their 'produce' from the big produce markets.


Big surprise, I have three farmers in the family and several friends and
none of them buy produce from some other source

Cheap shot; where do they buy their groceries?
Further shot; do thy grow/produce EVERYTHING they sell at a 'farmers
market'

but if there is one
thing that moron 2021 knows all about it is farming in California.


I wasn't aware that I did., but thank you for telling me. I do know a
little about farming in Australia as most of my ancestors came off
'farms' in Australia. Both my parents lines were mostly 'market gardeners/
orchardists, although my maternal grandfather successfully moved into
mixed grazier/grain cropping after his WWII service. I spent all my
childhood on various 'family farms' and have irregular contact there.
Plus,study Agricuture was a major component of all my years in high
school.

So, while I do not know everything, I've kept abreast of current farming
practice and the changes that have played out in farming in Australia and
some of the rest of the world.

That's because he is so brilliant that he could tell you the stock to
buy tomorrow to become a millionaire the next day.


No, I've never dealt in the share market, which is why I've been able to
retire. Pro tip; do not 'invest' in a farn.

That really takes the sort of talent that moron 2021 has.


Yep, that is why i'm debt free, with money in the bank and retired,
rather than being a dirt poor 'farmer'heaviy in debt.

  #36  
Old January 22nd 21, 05:32 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
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Posts: 4,018
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 17:31:43 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/

:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg


It might help to use slightly later data. From the US Farm Census for
2017[1]:
https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publications/AgCensus/2017/Full_Report/Volume_1,_Chapter_1_US/st99_1_0001_0001.pdf
Dividing 900,217,576 acres of farmland, by 2,042,220 farms, I get an
average of 441 acres per farm. Yet, you stated in a previous message:
"In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres"
I'm not aware of it so I would like to know where you found or how you
calculated a number that is off by a factor of 10.

More pubs and sources for US Farm Census:
https://www.nass.usda.gov/AgCensus/index.php
https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publications/AgCensus/2017/Full_Report/Volume_1,_Chapter_1_US/

[1] Nothing later seems to be available after the election of what's
his name in 2016.


--
Jeff Liebermann
PO Box 272
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #37  
Old January 22nd 21, 05:45 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,018
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 16:19:02 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

How to Use a Small Farm for Tax Write Offs
https://smallbusiness.chron.com/use-small-farm-tax-write-offs-15880.html


More of the same:
"Farm Like A Billionaire--Harvest Tax Breaks"
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ashleaebeling/2012/06/06/farm-like-a-billionaire-harvest-tax-breaks/?sh=1770de0e5777
The section on "Property Tax Breaks" is rather interesting.




--
Jeff Liebermann
PO Box 272
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #38  
Old January 22nd 21, 09:45 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_4_]
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Posts: 853
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 8:31 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/
:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


If you had even a passing clue what you were talking about you would
probably stop sucking Slocumb off.
https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg
It should come as no surprise that a mechanical engineer who taught
does even have a passing understanding of statistics.


OK,Tom, use that table and compute your estimate for the mean acreage of
a California farm, and of a U.S. farm. Tell us your answers and show
your work. I'm very curious how you get an answer of 40 acres.


You don’t even have to do the math. It’s at the bottom of the table.
However, are we talking mean, median or mode here? I’m sure that the mean
farm size is higher than the median or more farm size.

  #39  
Old January 22nd 21, 01:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tosspot[_6_]
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Posts: 86
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On 22/01/2021 09:45, Ralph Barone wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 8:31 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 9:11:16 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/
:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?

If you had even a passing clue what you were talking about you would
probably stop sucking Slocumb off.
https://www.lodigrowers.com/wp-conte...012-census.jpg
It should come as no surprise that a mechanical engineer who taught
does even have a passing understanding of statistics.


OK,Tom, use that table and compute your estimate for the mean acreage of
a California farm, and of a U.S. farm. Tell us your answers and show
your work. I'm very curious how you get an answer of 40 acres.


You don’t even have to do the math. It’s at the bottom of the table.


Don't tap the glass!

However, are we talking mean, median or mode here? I’m sure that the mean
farm size is higher than the median or more farm size.


  #40  
Old January 22nd 21, 05:22 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Posts: 2,196
Default Bike shops, rules, principles and law

On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 4:59:46 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 16:24:24 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:
On Fri, 22 Jan 2021 05:42:46 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 12:11:14 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 1/21/2021 12:53 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 21:06:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:
In case you are unaware of it, the standard farm is only 40 acres.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...us-since-2000/

:-) It's like shooting fish in a barrel, isn't it?


Yup, but is sort of pitiful in today's world where information is
literally at one's finger tip.


Not quite. Data is at everyone's finger tip. However, to get
information, you either have to processes that data yourself, hire
someone to process it for you, or get it for free from talking heads
or organizations that manipulate the data for their own benefit.

True, one definition of information certainly is "a collection of
facts from which conclusions may be drawn" but one has to assume that
the average person is capable of, at least, limited thought and should
be capable of converting said collection of facts into a reasonably
facsimile of information.

Of course, if one dives straight into the informational stream one
might find that it is very shallow in some places. Or to translate,
"some information is not factual" but then it appears that non-factual
information suits some people's illusions (or delusions) far better
then actual facts :-)


You are perfectly happy to lie through your teeth to prove any point you wish to make. Either that or you are so ****ing stupid it doesn't even occur to you that 75% of all farms have under 100 acres and one farm with 10,000 acres offsets that number you used simply because you wanted to counter my argument. You have something seriously wrong in your head and you have shown it time after time after time in your postings here to the point where everyone but Kragowski doesn't bother with your stupidity. And the only reason that Kragowski does is because he is a communist by nature and doesn't want any conservative thought to be voiced anywhere in the world.
 




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