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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
donquijote1954 wrote in
oups.com: On Aug 3, 7:49 am, "Keats" wrote: How did anyone on this planet survive for those millions of years before the invention of under arm deodorant and automobile air conditioners? Wouldn't they too seem to be a basic human right, Jeff?- I don't know about those, but the right to ride a bike in safety should be a human right. I think it's covered in the UDHR, under article 3, and to some extent, article 5 with regard to roadies vs freds and lycra vs denim. http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html |
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
"donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? |
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
Keats wrote:
"donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... \ The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? POTW! |
#24
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
On Aug 3, 12:26 pm, "Keats" wrote:
"donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? "Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers" -Aristotle The midgets are what defines "democracy"... Or should be define it anyway. |
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
"donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 3, 12:26 pm, "Keats" wrote: "donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? "Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers" -Aristotle The midgets are what defines "democracy"... Or should be define it anyway. "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." WINSTON CHURCHILL |
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
In article ,
"Keats" writes: "donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 3, 12:26 pm, "Keats" wrote: "donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? "Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers" -Aristotle The midgets are what defines "democracy"... Or should be define it anyway. "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." WINSTON CHURCHILL "Democracy becomes a government of bullies tempered by editors." -- R. W. Emerson -- Nothing is safe from me. I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca |
#27
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
"Tom Keats" wrote in message ... In article , "Keats" writes: "donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 3, 12:26 pm, "Keats" wrote: "donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? "Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers" -Aristotle The midgets are what defines "democracy"... Or should be define it anyway. "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." WINSTON CHURCHILL "Democracy becomes a government of bullies tempered by editors." -- R. W. Emerson -- There seems to be tons of democracy quotes. Rather than doing battling quotes I suggest all those interested Google "democracy quotes" and groove on their own personal favorites. The no relation to Tom Keats Keats |
#28
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
In article ,
"Keats" writes: "Tom Keats" wrote in message ... "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." WINSTON CHURCHILL "Democracy becomes a government of bullies tempered by editors." -- R. W. Emerson There seems to be tons of democracy quotes. Rather than doing battling quotes I suggest all those interested Google "democracy quotes" and groove on their own personal favorites. DonQuijote says he wants democracy and rails against the status quo; maybe what he really needs is sympathetic editors/media personnel. Maybe he should set up a print shop and become real media personnel himself. But I guess that would mean he'd have to become a /real/ bike activist and assume the responsibilities thereof, instead of just being a cheap-talk, Usenet ****-disturber, lyric cyclist. The no relation to Tom Keats Keats I hope you're sure 'bout that. One of my worst fears is discovering hitherto unknown progeny. cheers, Tom -- Nothing is safe from me. I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca |
#29
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
On Aug 3, 5:45 pm, "Keats" wrote:
"donquijote1954" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 3, 12:26 pm, "Keats" wrote: "donquijote1954" wrote in message groups.com... On Aug 2, 10:56 pm, "Tom \"Johnny Sunset\" Sherman" wrote: The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. The use it here too! Just that they give tax breaks and all kinds of facilities to those at the top. Have you noticed that 99% fo the bike paths are concentrated where the big people live? If the midgets aren't complaining, then so what? "Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers" -Aristotle The midgets are what defines "democracy"... Or should be define it anyway. "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." Luckily, today we only require that the citizen casts a vote every four years. Any kind of conversation is discouraged, just in case. |
#30
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The Great Don Quijote of RBM!
Keats WHO? wrote:
"Jeff Grippe" wrote in message ... The governments (federal, state and local) in the U.S. (and many other countries) use taxes to discourage behavior and tax breaks to encourage behavior. I am merely recommending the proper use of this common policy tool. Wow! A real discussion with substance. Part of the problem is that taxes (and tax breaks) are used for too many things. Some taxes are obviously used to fund the basic operations of government and the services it provides. Other taxes are used to specifically discourage behavior such as cigarette. Some tax breaks are used to encourage behavior. The problem is that all of these things get jumbled up. The bean counters come to rely on the revenue generated by the "sin taxes" and want to keep the breaks to a minimum so that they can balance the books. You can say something like "We are going to tax all X's in order to provide Y's" (cars for bike lanes, etc.) but the X's are going to complain and the Y's are going to view what they've got as an entitlement. You will get the X lobby fighting for the repeal of the tax and the Y lobby insisting that their service must continue to be provided. The people whose job it is to make the budge work try to please as many as possible (being part of a political system) but ultimately the stronger lobby wins. As liberal as I am, I can see some of the arguements for smaller government. Government is a grossly inefficient thing. The problem is that there are gaps a mile wide in what the free market will provide in terms of basic human services. If food, clothing, shelter, education, and health care are basic human rights, then the free market will not, of its own accord, provide a basic level of these things to everyone. Why should it? Corporations are supposed to make profits not provide basic human services. It took workers organizing for companies to provide good working conditions, shorter hours, higher pay, benefits, etc. The revolution isn't coming, however. So the system that we've got is one in which those who can push hardest might be able to get what they want. You want lockers and showers? Find a way to deliver a large block of votes and you might get them. Or find a philanthropist who believes in lockers and showers and get a foundation started. Be careful, however. Foundations can be almost as inefficient as governments. Jeff The idea of entitlements knows no limits. Therefore the inefficient use of tax money knows no practical limits other than the amount of money in the government coffers at any given time. Once citizens discovered they could vote themselves money out of the public weal entitlements were off and running to the point that someone who doesn't reach the work place in an air conditioned car wants the government to force the installation of a shower and locker on private property for their private use. The cost is not only the actual cost, but is also the cost of lost opportunity for a better and more efficient use of this money. And the better use of tax money is subsidizing NON-SUSTAINABLE, ENVIRONMENTALLY DEGRADING, CONGESTING CAUSING, individual fossil-fuel powered transport? SHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESH!!!!!!! Not to mention that showers and bicycle lockers are MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE than all the fossil-fuel powered subsidies (including the bill to come for $2,000,000,000,000.00 for the adventure in Mess-O-Potamia), to which we can add the costs of environmental damage. By the way, since I first brought up the idea, I own an air-conditioned automobile and use it for commuting. HAH! However; I wish I could afford to live close enough to work to cycle commute and had a shower there. How did anyone on this planet survive for those millions of years before the invention of under arm deodorant and automobile air conditioners? Wouldn't they too seem to be a basic human right, Jeff? Life in those times, to borrow a phrase from Hobbes, was poor, nasty, brutish, and short. We can do better. -- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia The weather is here, wish you were beautiful -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
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