Bus lanes suspended

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

On 30/10/2013 09:37, Brian Robertson wrote:
I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We aren't.

"We" know what the effects are, and nowhere has it even been an
intention to reduce congestion - rather the reverse.

The earliest discriminatory moves in Liverpool were made in 1974, when
Church Street was closed to traffic completely (thus severing the
traffic system in the city centre) and only buses were allowed to use
Lord Street (the westward extension of Church Street) and those parts of
Whitechapel and Paradise Street which linked with it. The immediate
result was traffic paralysis. So naturally, over the years, the council
wanted ever more of it, on the basis that councillors and professional
officers know best about everything.

A year or so later, having seen the LT operation in Seven Sisters Road,
Liverpool decided to mark out a "bus lane" on Picton Road, denying the
nearside lane to normal traffic between the railway bridge at Botanic
Gardens and the Wellington Road/Rathbone Road traffic lights. Result:
eastbound paralysis from Edge Hill through to Wavertree.

Today, the city is infested with so-called "bus lanes" (ie, parts of the
carriageway from which traffic is banned for some or all of the day).
Liverpool has changed from being a city with rather few traffic problems
(c. 1973) to a city where today, every journey is a nightmare and those
who live nearby (as I used to) wouldn't dream of using Liverpool city
centre as a retail facility.

*If* Liverpool has realised the errors implicit within the ways of its
previous administrations, that is to be welcomed. I'd rather see the DoT
intervene and scrap all bus-lanes on public roads. Bus-lanes which have
been built as a separate network (and there are a few, notably in
Runcorn) should remain.

Although I wouldn't vote for his party, I quite like the style of this
new mayor, Joe Anderson. I don't agree with everything he says, but he
has already made a splash in several areas. He was on R4 yesterday
supporting the HS2 line (which is certainly not a pet project of mine)
and criticising Labour's current national approach to it.

On 30/10/2013 09:56, JNugent wrote:
On 30/10/2013 09:37, Brian Robertson wrote:
I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We aren't.

"We" know what the effects are, and nowhere has it even been an
intention to reduce congestion - rather the reverse.

The earliest discriminatory moves in Liverpool were made in 1974, when
Church Street was closed to traffic completely (thus severing the
traffic system in the city centre) and only buses were allowed to use
Lord Street (the westward extension of Church Street) and those parts of
Whitechapel and Paradise Street which linked with it. The immediate
result was traffic paralysis. So naturally, over the years, the council
wanted ever more of it, on the basis that councillors and professional
officers know best about everything.

A year or so later, having seen the LT operation in Seven Sisters Road,
Liverpool decided to mark out a "bus lane" on Picton Road, denying the
nearside lane to normal traffic between the railway bridge at Botanic
Gardens and the Wellington Road/Rathbone Road traffic lights. Result:
eastbound paralysis from Edge Hill through to Wavertree.

Today, the city is infested with so-called "bus lanes" (ie, parts of the
carriageway from which traffic is banned for some or all of the day).
Liverpool has changed from being a city with rather few traffic problems
(c. 1973) to a city where today, every journey is a nightmare and those
who live nearby (as I used to) wouldn't dream of using Liverpool city
centre as a retail facility.

*If* Liverpool has realised the errors implicit within the ways of its
previous administrations, that is to be welcomed. I'd rather see the DoT
intervene and scrap all bus-lanes on public roads. Bus-lanes which have
been built as a separate network (and there are a few, notably in
Runcorn) should remain.

Although I wouldn't vote for his party, I quite like the style of this
new mayor, Joe Anderson. I don't agree with everything he says, but he
has already made a splash in several areas. He was on R4 yesterday
supporting the HS2 line (which is certainly not a pet project of mine)
and criticising Labour's current national approach to it.



More rubbish from binugent.

On 30/10/2013 12:13, Zapp Brannigan wrote:

"Brian Robertson" wrote in message
...
I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Obviously letting motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists

There's no need for this sort of silly rhetoric. Many cyclists are also
motorists, many motorists are also cyclists.

You are coming on THIS group and complaining about silly rhetoric?

On Wed, 30 Oct 2013 10:48:48 +0000, Brian Robertson wrote:

On 30/10/2013 09:56, JNugent wrote:
On 30/10/2013 09:37, Brian Robertson wrote:
I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in
a 9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously
letting motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there
is a wider issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We aren't.

"We" know what the effects are, and nowhere has it even been an
intention to reduce congestion - rather the reverse.

The earliest discriminatory moves in Liverpool were made in 1974, when
Church Street was closed to traffic completely (thus severing the
traffic system in the city centre) and only buses were allowed to use
Lord Street (the westward extension of Church Street) and those parts
of Whitechapel and Paradise Street which linked with it. The immediate
result was traffic paralysis. So naturally, over the years, the council
wanted ever more of it, on the basis that councillors and professional
officers know best about everything.

A year or so later, having seen the LT operation in Seven Sisters Road,
Liverpool decided to mark out a "bus lane" on Picton Road, denying the
nearside lane to normal traffic between the railway bridge at Botanic
Gardens and the Wellington Road/Rathbone Road traffic lights. Result:
eastbound paralysis from Edge Hill through to Wavertree.

Today, the city is infested with so-called "bus lanes" (ie, parts of
the carriageway from which traffic is banned for some or all of the
day). Liverpool has changed from being a city with rather few traffic
problems (c. 1973) to a city where today, every journey is a nightmare
and those who live nearby (as I used to) wouldn't dream of using
Liverpool city centre as a retail facility.

*If* Liverpool has realised the errors implicit within the ways of its
previous administrations, that is to be welcomed. I'd rather see the
DoT intervene and scrap all bus-lanes on public roads. Bus-lanes which
have been built as a separate network (and there are a few, notably in
Runcorn) should remain.

Although I wouldn't vote for his party, I quite like the style of this
new mayor, Joe Anderson. I don't agree with everything he says, but he
has already made a splash in several areas. He was on R4 yesterday
supporting the HS2 line (which is certainly not a pet project of mine)
and criticising Labour's current national approach to it.



More rubbish from binugent.

I don't think so.
I remember once driving down Oxford St, London (early 70's) when cars
were still allowed there. It was slow, but passable.
Then they banned cars from the street.
The result? Buses and taxis treated the street like a race-track, with
horrendous consequences for shoppers, pedestrians etc. It was much
safer when cars were allowed to clog up the street.

On 31/10/2013 21:46, Phil W Lee wrote:
Brian Robertson considered Wed, 30 Oct 2013
09:37:46 +0000 the perfect time to write:

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We can almost guarantee one effect - delayed public transport
encouraging more people to use the car.

What cretin came up with that idea?


Well, I don't know, Phil. I really would like to see studies on this.
Anything that hurts car drivers and helps public transport and cyclists
is fine with me, but I am really not sure that SOME bus lanes do the job.

On Thu, 31 Oct 2013 21:46:36 +0000, Phil W Lee
wrote:

Brian Robertson considered Wed, 30 Oct 2013
09:37:46 +0000 the perfect time to write:

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We can almost guarantee one effect - delayed public transport
encouraging more people to use the car.

What cretin came up with that idea?

The same one who turned one lane of my local 70mph dual carriageway
into a bus lane that is used by one bus every 15 minutes.

On Fri, 01 Nov 2013 09:59:47 +0000, Brian Robertson
wrote:

On 31/10/2013 21:46, Phil W Lee wrote:
Brian Robertson considered Wed, 30 Oct 2013
09:37:46 +0000 the perfect time to write:

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We can almost guarantee one effect - delayed public transport
encouraging more people to use the car.

What cretin came up with that idea?


Well, I don't know, Phil. I really would like to see studies on this.
Anything that hurts car drivers and helps public transport and cyclists
is fine with me

Those pesky car drivers who want to get to work on time and spend
their money in local shops. *******s.

On 01/11/2013 19:44, Cassandra wrote:
On Fri, 01 Nov 2013 09:59:47 +0000, Brian Robertson
wrote:

On 31/10/2013 21:46, Phil W Lee wrote:
Brian Robertson considered Wed, 30 Oct 2013
09:37:46 +0000 the perfect time to write:

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We can almost guarantee one effect - delayed public transport
encouraging more people to use the car.

What cretin came up with that idea?


Well, I don't know, Phil. I really would like to see studies on this.
Anything that hurts car drivers and helps public transport and cyclists
is fine with me

Those pesky car drivers who want to get to work on time and spend
their money in local shops. *******s.

How stupid of you. Those "*******s" spending money in the local shops,
help to keep YOUR local shops open which gives a knock on effect of
helping the council to keep YOUR council tax lower, because thriving
shops pay commercial rates. Empy shops don't pay anything.
Be careful for what you wish for, because most of your shops may shut
and be boarded up, turning your town into a ghost town.

On 01/11/2013 20:10, Bod wrote:
On 01/11/2013 19:44, Cassandra wrote:
On Fri, 01 Nov 2013 09:59:47 +0000, Brian Robertson
wrote:

On 31/10/2013 21:46, Phil W Lee wrote:
Brian Robertson considered Wed, 30 Oct 2013
09:37:46 +0000 the perfect time to write:

I wonder what people think of this one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...yside-24606912

Basically, Liverpool council have removed bus lanes across the city
in a
9 month experiment to see if congestion is reduced. Obviously letting
motorist scum use bus lanes impacts upon cyclists, but there is a
wider
issue here that impacts upon every road user.

Bus lanes are universal in all of our major cities and towns (Has
anywhere not adopted them?) and a similar situation probably exists
around the world. In my own neck of the woods, my local council is
making threatening noises about enforcing them with lots more cameras.
They have been going for years and years. Surely somebody has done a
study to assess their effectiveness? How can we possibly be at a point
years on and thousands of miles of bus lanes later in countless
countries where we don't know if they are effective or not?

We can almost guarantee one effect - delayed public transport
encouraging more people to use the car.

What cretin came up with that idea?


Well, I don't know, Phil. I really would like to see studies on this.
Anything that hurts car drivers and helps public transport and cyclists
is fine with me

Those pesky car drivers who want to get to work on time and spend
their money in local shops. *******s.

How stupid of you. Those "*******s" spending money in the local shops,
help to keep YOUR local shops open which gives a knock on effect of
helping the council to keep YOUR council tax lower, because thriving
shops pay commercial rates. Empy shops don't pay anything.
Be careful for what you wish for, because most of your shops may shut
and be boarded up, turning your town into a ghost town.

Whoops! I may have responded to the wrong person here. crawls into a
corner.