Cartridge bottom brackets

On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 9:51:13 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/04/17 01:44, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 12:30:34 AM UTC-7, James wrote:

I still haven't given my lights any attention or thought beyond
turning them on and off. I used my bicycle lights several times
for hours at a time recently while on a 9 day cycling touring
holiday, for before sunrise starts and during bad weather and fog.

No thoughts of silicone grip or velcro, or additional handlebar
clutter, as my front light is securely attached to the fork crown
with the front brake.

I had no issue with extra weight, or the "complexity" of wiring, or
even unnoticeable drag, with totally acceptable visibility.


Then that solution worked for you. The nice thing about a battery
light is that you can use it as a camp light, if you're camping. In
bad weather (rain), I also think a flasher is a better DRL. Either a
StVZO dyno light or a focused battery light is a decent choice for
fog. I certainly wouldn't use a high output flasher or a high
output/high spew front light in fog unless I wanted to blind myself.


If I were doing a bicycle vacation, I'd take a battery light so I
could take it off the bike. I don't see any reason for hauling
lighting equipment around on a sunny day out in the country.

We started one morning when it was just light, fresh and quite clear.
Then just as the sun began to warm us we rode into thick fog. The fog
lasted for about 30km or more. Then we emerged from the fog to a clear
day again.

What would you have done? We didn't know there was fog 20km from the
start. You would likely have decided not to "haul lighting equipment
around on a sunny day out in the country", only to find that you needed
it 40 minutes later, then you'd want to take it off again an hour after
that.

What a charade!

I would do what I actually do, turn on my little low-watt USB blinky that sits on my bars (if too bright in the fog, run it as a fixed light) -- or do nothing. Riding in that kind of weather (and much worse) is what I do every day for half the year or more. On weekend rides, I take my little blinky this time of year. I also wear high viz clothing. More high viz than these guys: http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos...tland-fog..jpg That was part of my ride yesterday, although less foggy. (a couple of local pros with no lights).

I bought a dynamo two years ago as a science project. In the worst weather, my dyno light is a joke -- and one could easily argue that dyno lights are DANGEROUS! "I had to ride home in pitch dark, driving rain with high winds and blow-down accumulating at my feet and couldn't see a thing with my LUXOS B. How could anyone get by without a battery light?" I could have died! What a charade!

The likelihood that I'm going to put a dyno on my weekend bike(s) to go riding in daylight is zero. I'm also not going to put a rack on my SuperSix although racks are highly useful.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Monday, April 10, 2017 at 7:20:36 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 9:51:13 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/04/17 01:44, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 12:30:34 AM UTC-7, James wrote:

I still haven't given my lights any attention or thought beyond
turning them on and off. I used my bicycle lights several times
for hours at a time recently while on a 9 day cycling touring
holiday, for before sunrise starts and during bad weather and fog.

No thoughts of silicone grip or velcro, or additional handlebar
clutter, as my front light is securely attached to the fork crown
with the front brake.

I had no issue with extra weight, or the "complexity" of wiring, or
even unnoticeable drag, with totally acceptable visibility.


Then that solution worked for you. The nice thing about a battery
light is that you can use it as a camp light, if you're camping. In
bad weather (rain), I also think a flasher is a better DRL. Either a
StVZO dyno light or a focused battery light is a decent choice for
fog. I certainly wouldn't use a high output flasher or a high
output/high spew front light in fog unless I wanted to blind myself.


If I were doing a bicycle vacation, I'd take a battery light so I
could take it off the bike. I don't see any reason for hauling
lighting equipment around on a sunny day out in the country.

We started one morning when it was just light, fresh and quite clear.
Then just as the sun began to warm us we rode into thick fog. The fog
lasted for about 30km or more. Then we emerged from the fog to a clear
day again.

What would you have done? We didn't know there was fog 20km from the
start. You would likely have decided not to "haul lighting equipment
around on a sunny day out in the country", only to find that you needed
it 40 minutes later, then you'd want to take it off again an hour after
that.

What a charade!

I would do what I actually do, turn on my little low-watt USB blinky that sits on my bars (if too bright in the fog, run it as a fixed light) -- or do nothing. Riding in that kind of weather (and much worse) is what I do every day for half the year or more. On weekend rides, I take my little blinky this time of year. I also wear high viz clothing. More high viz than these guys: http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos...rtland-fog.jpg That was part of my ride yesterday, although less foggy. (a couple of local pros with no lights).

I bought a dynamo two years ago as a science project. In the worst weather, my dyno light is a joke -- and one could easily argue that dyno lights are DANGEROUS! "I had to ride home in pitch dark, driving rain with high winds and blow-down accumulating at my feet and couldn't see a thing with my LUXOS B. How could anyone get by without a battery light?" I could have died! What a charade!

The likelihood that I'm going to put a dyno on my weekend bike(s) to go riding in daylight is zero. I'm also not going to put a rack on my SuperSix although racks are highly useful.

-- Jay Beattie.

200 postings about generator or battery lights and now the bottom bracket thread get's hijacked to lights?

You guys are all tipsy or something. To read this one would think that no one rides in the daylight.

On 4/9/2017 8:45 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I also don't agree that a battery powered light offers "greater
simplicity". While the battery light does not have the usual tangle
of wires, it does have the added tasks of juggling batteries or
removing the light from the bicycle for charging. Removing the covers
and extracting the batteries from some battery lights is not easy,
especially when wearing gloves.

That's really my main point regarding dynamo lights. Battery light
users say "It's simpler than a dynamo! I just have to clamp it on my
handlebar in the right position. Oh, and make sure it's tilted
properly. Of course, I have to remember to keep the battery charged -
or maybe remember how long the disposable batteries have been used.
Sure, if it's too long, I'll have to remember to throw some spare
batteries in my bag. And maybe another little flashlight so I can see
to change them if they burn out. But it's simple!"

Me, I turn on the light when it gets dark, just as when driving my car.
_That's_ simple.

I will admit, installing a dynamo and bolting on a headlight is more of
a project. And after many decades, I've come to realize that lots of
people are baffled by "righty tighty, lefty loosey" let alone things
like Plus and Minus wires.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 4/10/2017 10:32 AM, wrote:

200 postings about generator or battery lights and now the bottom bracket thread get's hijacked to lights?

The phrase "highjacking a thread" reminds me of the DVD warnings:
"Piracy is not a victimless crime!"

Um, yes. You should not enter a high-speed power boat carrying AK-47s
and mortars and attack oil freighters to hold their crews hostage for
ransom. Somebody might get hurt! And copying a DVD is just as bad!

A thread is a conversation. Conversations don't normally have referees
yelling "Out of bounds!" If you want to bring a thread back to the
title topic, post something about the title topic.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 11:09:17 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 4/9/2017 8:45 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I also don't agree that a battery powered light offers "greater
simplicity". While the battery light does not have the usual tangle
of wires, it does have the added tasks of juggling batteries or
removing the light from the bicycle for charging. Removing the covers
and extracting the batteries from some battery lights is not easy,
especially when wearing gloves.

That's really my main point regarding dynamo lights. Battery light
users say "It's simpler than a dynamo! I just have to clamp it on my
handlebar in the right position. Oh, and make sure it's tilted
properly. Of course, I have to remember to keep the battery charged -
or maybe remember how long the disposable batteries have been used.
Sure, if it's too long, I'll have to remember to throw some spare
batteries in my bag. And maybe another little flashlight so I can see
to change them if they burn out. But it's simple!"

I haven't had the problem, but needing a 2nd light (or a match) to
help dig through my junk bag for spare batteries is certainly a
possibility. However, I carry mine wrapped in cellophane wrap (to
prevent shorts) making the batteries easy to find by feel. (Finding
my reading glasses so I can see what's in the bag is more of a problem
for me).

Me, I turn on the light when it gets dark, just as when driving my car.
_That's_ simple.

When it gets dark, I theoretically excavate the headlight out of my
junk bag, attach it to the handlebars, and ride off into the sunset. I
say theoretically because I'm a fair-weather cyclist who avoids riding
in the dark.

I will admit, installing a dynamo and bolting on a headlight is more of
a project.

I've commented on this in the past. My solution was to suggest that
the frame be pre-wired for dynamo lights at the factory. The trick is
to put the holes in the frame where they do not act as stress risers.
Running wires through transition areas (head tube and seat tube) is
not easy, but it can be done.

If complexity of bicycle lighting is a problem worth solving, methinks
that standardizing on the handlebar mounting would be a big help.
Making the mount a permanent part of the handlebar would be even
better. I once sacrificed an old bent aluminum handlebar and tried to
attach various Pop-Rivet type threaded inserts for mounting lights.
Since the threads don't need to support much weight, tiny 4-40
threaded inserts could be used. It worked, but the handlebars could
not be rotated for the most comfortable position, so I gave up on that
idea. I had the same problem when I tried to attach a DIN rail
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=aluminum+din+rail
to the handlebars for accessories. It mostly worked, but the
handlebars again could not be rotated.

Assuming I can get past the wiring, drilling, and rotation problems, a
permanent mount for the light, with built in contacts for the wiring,
would go a long way to making both battery and dynamo lighting more
useful. However, it wouldn't sell. Most bicycle owners do not own a
working head or tail light, don't use either, don't ride at night, and
would be seriously offended if the added cost of my proposed wiring
and mounting system was included in the selling price of their
department store bicycle. A feature that is not used by perhaps 95%
of the potential buyers would instantly disappear in the first round
of cost cutting.

So, we're stuck with various clamp mounts, all of which slip, slide,
require rubber inserts that promptly disappear, or have self
destructing "quick release" locks. At least they perform the prime
objective, which is to not scratch the handlebar finish.

And after many decades, I've come to realize that lots of
people are baffled by "righty tighty, lefty loosey" let alone things
like Plus and Minus wires.

Yep. One has to get experience in such things at an early age because
learning such basics when older is difficult. At one company, I joked
that perhaps we should write the user manual in comic book format.
Instead of instant rejection, the idea was taken seriously and bounced
around upper management for months. It was eventually rejected
because of the high cost of hiring a professional illustrator (this
was before computah graphics).


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 07:32:51 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

200 postings about generator or battery lights and now the
bottom bracket thread get's hijacked to lights?

Barry Beams posted his experience with Tange as a company using his
headlight as an example. That started several discussions about
bicycle lighting. Such things happen and are often more interesting
than the original topic.

The real problem is that everyone tends to move the topic over to
areas in which they are interested or experienced. Most of my
comments are about lighting and psychology. Others will appear out of
the woodwork should you mention their favorite keyword. In another
newsgroup that I read, all (and I do mean all) discussions that start
off on a technical topic, drift into global warming or Trump bashing
within about 5 postings. Like the Ouija Board, nobody really
intentionally "hijacks" a thread, but many unconsciously push it
towards their preferred direction.

You guys are all tipsy or something. To read this one would
think that no one rides in the daylight.

Some things are best done under cover of darkness.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 11:09:17 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

Me, I turn on the light when it gets dark, just as when driving my car.
_That's_ simple.

I may have found the source of the problem:
http://yehudamoon.com/comic/2017-03-15/

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 4/10/2017 12:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 11:09:17 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote:


I will admit, installing a dynamo and bolting on a headlight is more of
a project.

I've commented on this in the past. My solution was to suggest that
the frame be pre-wired for dynamo lights at the factory. The trick is
to put the holes in the frame where they do not act as stress risers.
Running wires through transition areas (head tube and seat tube) is
not easy, but it can be done.

Actually, the first "10 speed" I ever bought had that internal wiring.
It was 1972, and I saw a German made "Staiger" for sale in a drug store.
(The tiny rural town I was working in had no bike shop.) IIRC, the
single wire entered the frame behind the bottom bracket and exited near
the head tube.

If complexity of bicycle lighting is a problem worth solving, methinks
that standardizing on the handlebar mounting would be a big help.
Making the mount a permanent part of the handlebar would be even
better.

I wouldn't like that. I have handlebar bags on almost every bike. I
find them almost indispensable. They make it difficult to use a light
mounted there.

Besides, I'm convinced a headlight mounted at about 24" to 28" high is
optimum. (See? We can argue about anything here!)


I once sacrificed an old bent aluminum handlebar and tried to
attach various Pop-Rivet type threaded inserts for mounting lights.
Since the threads don't need to support much weight, tiny 4-40
threaded inserts could be used. It worked, but the handlebars could
not be rotated for the most comfortable position, so I gave up on that
idea. I had the same problem when I tried to attach a DIN rail
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=aluminum+din+rail
to the handlebars for accessories. It mostly worked, but the
handlebars again could not be rotated.

I'd be very wary of drilling holes in a handlebar for any purpose. I
hate to channel Mr. Scharf, but I do know a guy who crashed badly when
his supposedly "aero" bars, with holes for cables, suddenly broke at a
hole during a sprint. Obviously a sudden fatigue failure triggered by
the stress concentration caused by the hole.

So, we're stuck with various clamp mounts, all of which slip, slide,
require rubber inserts that promptly disappear, or have self
destructing "quick release" locks. At least they perform the prime
objective, which is to not scratch the handlebar finish.

I've read that British bikes in days of yore used to come with standard
"lamp brackets" on the right front fork. But that was back when bikes
were expected to be useful.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 11/04/17 00:20, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 9:51:13 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/04/17 01:44, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 12:30:34 AM UTC-7, James wrote:

I still haven't given my lights any attention or thought
beyond turning them on and off. I used my bicycle lights
several times for hours at a time recently while on a 9 day
cycling touring holiday, for before sunrise starts and during
bad weather and fog.

No thoughts of silicone grip or velcro, or additional
handlebar clutter, as my front light is securely attached to
the fork crown with the front brake.

I had no issue with extra weight, or the "complexity" of
wiring, or even unnoticeable drag, with totally acceptable
visibility.


Then that solution worked for you. The nice thing about a
battery light is that you can use it as a camp light, if you're
camping. In bad weather (rain), I also think a flasher is a
better DRL. Either a StVZO dyno light or a focused battery light
is a decent choice for fog. I certainly wouldn't use a high
output flasher or a high output/high spew front light in fog
unless I wanted to blind myself.


If I were doing a bicycle vacation, I'd take a battery light so
I could take it off the bike. I don't see any reason for hauling
lighting equipment around on a sunny day out in the country.

We started one morning when it was just light, fresh and quite
clear. Then just as the sun began to warm us we rode into thick
fog. The fog lasted for about 30km or more. Then we emerged from
the fog to a clear day again.

What would you have done? We didn't know there was fog 20km from
the start. You would likely have decided not to "haul lighting
equipment around on a sunny day out in the country", only to find
that you needed it 40 minutes later, then you'd want to take it off
again an hour after that.

What a charade!

I would do what I actually do, turn on my little low-watt USB blinky
that sits on my bars (if too bright in the fog, run it as a fixed
light) -- or do nothing.

Now now, Jay. You wouldn't want to haul that blinky around on a sunny day.

Think of the unnecessary wind resistance!

--
JS

On Friday, April 7, 2017 at 1:57:50 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
I'm thinking of replacing the old three piece BB on one of my bikes
with a Shimano cartridge bearing and I see that Shimano markets a
UN-26 and UN-55 cartridge bottom bracket. I believe that the UN-26
has a solid spindle and a plastic bushing on the non-drive side while
there is reference to a hollow spindle and steel bushing on the UN-55.
Both are made for the 69 and 73 mm frames and in roughly the same
spindle lengths.

In normal use is there a practical difference? Disregarding the weight
difference, if any, is there a noticeable difference in service life?

The UN-26 seems to be the cheaper version and is quite common in shops
here while the UN-55 is somewhat rare, probably due to price. But if
the UN-55 lasts (for example) five years while the UN-26 only lasts
two years it is probably worth searching out the higher priced
version.
--
Cheers,

John B.

@Ridesalot, you proved you're the troll your message came across as.
I told you to inquire privately. You acted like the douche bag you are, with more non-constructive public banter. You continued in typical troll manner publicly to make a public spectacle of yourself rather than serving any use purpose, by your efforts to extort words out of other people's mouths under you implied, and then acted on, implied threat of defamation and libel if your intended victim won't act as you try to extort. The unsuitability here is you as a prospective customer. You, like anyone else, are welcome to call PRIVATELY to Oculus Lighting, to inquire on any aspect of the lifetime warranty or anything else about the product.