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Peter Sagan



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 5th 17, 02:47 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Default Peter Sagan

I looked as closely at the bad coverage as possible.

To me it appeared that Cavendish crossed Sagan's back wheel and touched it throwing Sagan slightly off-balance and all Sagan did was to re-balance himself. That was the elbow going out. Not to block Cavendish but to regain balance.

I couldn't even tell if Sagan's elbow even contacted Cavendish. And Cavendish was unclear about it in his interview. Though he was in a great deal of pain and so being unclear is more than forgivable.

I find it extremely irritating that a "jury" would believe that it is a sprinter's job to move out of the way of someone coming from behind.
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  #2  
Old July 6th 17, 04:42 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Michael[_10_]
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Default Peter Sagan

On Wednesday, July 5, 2017 at 8:47:56 AM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
I looked as closely at the bad coverage as possible.

To me it appeared that Cavendish crossed Sagan's back wheel and touched it throwing Sagan slightly off-balance and all Sagan did was to re-balance himself. That was the elbow going out. Not to block Cavendish but to regain balance.

I couldn't even tell if Sagan's elbow even contacted Cavendish. And Cavendish was unclear about it in his interview. Though he was in a great deal of pain and so being unclear is more than forgivable.

I find it extremely irritating that a "jury" would believe that it is a sprinter's job to move out of the way of someone coming from behind.


100 percent agree. Sagan said he didn't see Cavendish. There was about a bike length between Damare and Cavendish, and when Damare passed Sagan, Sagan followed. It looked like Sagan's move frustrated Cavendish, so he pushed his head and shoulder into Sagan to get Sagan out of Cavendish's way, causing his own fall. Very unfortunate all the way around.
  #3  
Old July 7th 17, 03:54 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Posts: 40
Default Peter Sagan

On Thursday, July 6, 2017 at 8:42:51 AM UTC-7, Michael wrote:
On Wednesday, July 5, 2017 at 8:47:56 AM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
I looked as closely at the bad coverage as possible.

To me it appeared that Cavendish crossed Sagan's back wheel and touched it throwing Sagan slightly off-balance and all Sagan did was to re-balance himself. That was the elbow going out. Not to block Cavendish but to regain balance.

I couldn't even tell if Sagan's elbow even contacted Cavendish. And Cavendish was unclear about it in his interview. Though he was in a great deal of pain and so being unclear is more than forgivable.

I find it extremely irritating that a "jury" would believe that it is a sprinter's job to move out of the way of someone coming from behind.


100 percent agree. Sagan said he didn't see Cavendish. There was about a bike length between Damare and Cavendish, and when Damare passed Sagan, Sagan followed. It looked like Sagan's move frustrated Cavendish, so he pushed his head and shoulder into Sagan to get Sagan out of Cavendish's way, causing his own fall. Very unfortunate all the way around.


This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what happened. It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's arm went out only to maintain his balance.
  #4  
Old July 7th 17, 10:56 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Turbo
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Posts: 3
Default Peter Sagan

On 2017-07-07, Tom Kunich wrote:
This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what happened.
It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's arm went out only
to maintain his balance.


No matter the reason why the arm went out, at the time the arm went out,
Cavendish was already falling on the right side.

So, arm has nothing to do with the crash.

Question is only whether Sagan knew that Cav is there when he moved
right...

Regarding keeping line, sprint was chaotic, Sagan is not only one that
whas changing the line.

But crush 1500m from finish, that was epic break through two riders


--
obruT


  #5  
Old July 8th 17, 02:53 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Davey Crockett[_13_]
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Posts: 50
Default Peter Sagan

Tom Kunich a écrit profondement:

| On Thursday, July 6, 2017 at 8:42:51 AM UTC-7, Michael wrote:
| On Wednesday, July 5, 2017 at 8:47:56 AM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
| I looked as closely at the bad coverage as possible.
|
| To me it appeared that Cavendish crossed Sagan's back wheel and
| touched it throwing Sagan slightly off-balance and all Sagan did
| was to re-balance himself. That was the elbow going out. Not to
| block Cavendish but to regain balance.
|
| I couldn't even tell if Sagan's elbow even contacted
| Cavendish. And Cavendish was unclear about it in his
| interview. Though he was in a great deal of pain and so being
| unclear is more than forgivable.
|
| I find it extremely irritating that a "jury" would believe that it
| is a sprinter's job to move out of the way of someone coming from
| behind.
|
| 100 percent agree. Sagan said he didn't see Cavendish. There was
| about a bike length between Damare and Cavendish, and when Damare
| passed Sagan, Sagan followed. It looked like Sagan's move frustrated
| Cavendish, so he pushed his head and shoulder into Sagan to get
| Sagan out of Cavendish's way, causing his own fall. Very unfortunate
| all the way around.

| This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what
| happened. It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's arm went
| out only to maintain his balance.

Truly unfortunate.

But a large portion of the "blame", or "negligence" belonged to
Cavendish.


--
Davey Crockett
  #6  
Old July 10th 17, 04:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Posts: 40
Default Peter Sagan

On Friday, July 7, 2017 at 2:56:15 AM UTC-7, Turbo wrote:
On 2017-07-07, Tom Kunich wrote:
This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what happened.
It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's arm went out only
to maintain his balance.


No matter the reason why the arm went out, at the time the arm went out,
Cavendish was already falling on the right side.

So, arm has nothing to do with the crash.

Question is only whether Sagan knew that Cav is there when he moved
right...

Regarding keeping line, sprint was chaotic, Sagan is not only one that
whas changing the line.

But crush 1500m from finish, that was epic break through two riders


It doesn't matter if Sagan knew he was there or not. It is not a sprinter's responsibility to make room for a man behind him.

This was not simply a bad decision of the race jury, but an insulting one that makes you wonder what is going on. We've heard it said that this years course was planned with less climbing to try and break Team Sky and Froome's domination of the event.

I believe that courses should be changed so that they give all specialists a try at the yellow but I do not believe that any course should be purposely aimed at eliminating a team.
  #7  
Old July 10th 17, 07:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Theodore Heise[_2_]
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Posts: 132
Default Peter Sagan

On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 08:11:20 -0700 (PDT),
Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, July 7, 2017 at 2:56:15 AM UTC-7, Turbo wrote:
On 2017-07-07, Tom Kunich wrote:
This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what
happened. It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's
arm went out only to maintain his balance.


No matter the reason why the arm went out, at the time the arm
went out, Cavendish was already falling on the right side.

So, arm has nothing to do with the crash.

Question is only whether Sagan knew that Cav is there when he
moved right...

Regarding keeping line, sprint was chaotic, Sagan is not only
one that whas changing the line.

But crush 1500m from finish, that was epic break through two
riders


It doesn't matter if Sagan knew he was there or not. It is not
a sprinter's responsibility to make room for a man behind him.

This was not simply a bad decision of the race jury, but an
insulting one that makes you wonder what is going on.


Gotta agree with you to this point.


...We've heard it said that this years course was planned with
less climbing to try and break Team Sky and Froome's domination
of the event.


Wouldn't surprise me in the least, and it also seems reasonable.
The more competitive the race is, the greater the interest (and
that can't hurt viewership or revenuw).


I believe that courses should be changed so that they give all
specialists a try at the yellow but I do not believe that any
course should be purposely aimed at eliminating a team.


How are these different if the course favors a certain style, and
a team has been developed to take advantage of the style?

--
Ted Heise Bloomington, IN, USA
  #8  
Old July 22nd 17, 10:49 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Tom Kunich[_4_]
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Posts: 40
Default Peter Sagan

On Monday, July 10, 2017 at 11:09:34 AM UTC-7, Theodore Heise wrote:
On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 08:11:20 -0700 (PDT),
Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, July 7, 2017 at 2:56:15 AM UTC-7, Turbo wrote:
On 2017-07-07, Tom Kunich wrote:
This morning they put a slo-mo on so that you could see what
happened. It was Cavendish leaning against Sagan and Sagan's
arm went out only to maintain his balance.

No matter the reason why the arm went out, at the time the arm
went out, Cavendish was already falling on the right side.

So, arm has nothing to do with the crash.

Question is only whether Sagan knew that Cav is there when he
moved right...

Regarding keeping line, sprint was chaotic, Sagan is not only
one that whas changing the line.

But crush 1500m from finish, that was epic break through two
riders


It doesn't matter if Sagan knew he was there or not. It is not
a sprinter's responsibility to make room for a man behind him.

This was not simply a bad decision of the race jury, but an
insulting one that makes you wonder what is going on.


Gotta agree with you to this point.


...We've heard it said that this years course was planned with
less climbing to try and break Team Sky and Froome's domination
of the event.


Wouldn't surprise me in the least, and it also seems reasonable.
The more competitive the race is, the greater the interest (and
that can't hurt viewership or revenuw).


I believe that courses should be changed so that they give all
specialists a try at the yellow but I do not believe that any
course should be purposely aimed at eliminating a team.


How are these different if the course favors a certain style, and
a team has been developed to take advantage of the style?

--
Ted Heise Bloomington, IN, USA


Well, we didn't have a team time trial and we didn't have any long distance time trials. Sky was so strong that they would have had overwhelming advantaged in these sorts of things. Also high Alp's stages with mountain top finishes early would set up both better stages and also set competition into their proper places more rapidly so that teams could plan their attacks more appropriately. The only reason that Aru got into Yellow was that Froome had an "off" day that would have been anyone else's great day.
 




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