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bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 16th 08, 09:53 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
KingOfTheApes
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Posts: 1,468
Default bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes

Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
"I don't usually ride on the sidewalk because I like to ride faster
than 5mph. End of story."

This kid has a concern for pedestrians...

"If you're over 13 years old it is illegal to ride a bike on the
sidewalk, plus cyclists are being curtious to walkers and joggers but
most importantly road bikes are simply too fast for the sidewalk, a
crack or uneven section could be devastating. You just have to have
some patience and learn to pass with out nearly killing everyone."

But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Riding a bike costs peanuts --which is why monkeys love biking"

http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote88
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  #2  
Old July 17th 08, 12:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
Brian Huntley
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Posts: 641
Default bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes

On Jul 16, 4:53*pm, KingOfTheApes wrote:

But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).


No, you might as well say there's no place for private cars in town.
Bikes don't seem to have problems passing, only cars do.

  #3  
Old July 17th 08, 02:26 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,uk.rec.cycling
Tom Sherman[_2_]
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Posts: 9,890
Default bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes

[rec.bicycle.rides snipped]

KingOfTheChickens wrote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
"I don't usually ride on the sidewalk because I like to ride faster
than 5mph. End of story."

This kid has a concern for pedestrians...

"If you're over 13 years old it is illegal to ride a bike on the
sidewalk, plus cyclists are being curtious to walkers and joggers but
most importantly road bikes are simply too fast for the sidewalk, a
crack or uneven section could be devastating. You just have to have
some patience and learn to pass with out nearly killing everyone."

But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).

Is this guy truly (and unreasonably) terrified of vehicles, or just an
anti-cycling troll?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"People who had no mercy will find none." - Anon.
  #4  
Old July 17th 08, 03:57 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
KingOfTheApes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,468
Default bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes

On Jul 16, 9:26 pm, Tom Sherman
wrote:

KingOfTheChickens wrote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
"I don't usually ride on the sidewalk because I like to ride faster
than 5mph. End of story."


This kid has a concern for pedestrians...


"If you're over 13 years old it is illegal to ride a bike on the
sidewalk, plus cyclists are being curtious to walkers and joggers but
most importantly road bikes are simply too fast for the sidewalk, a
crack or uneven section could be devastating. You just have to have
some patience and learn to pass with out nearly killing everyone."


But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).


Is this guy truly (and unreasonably) terrified of vehicles, or just an
anti-cycling troll?


Pity, the majority of American who do NOT ride bikes to work (96.6% of
them) agree with me. So does this parent...

14. I noticed in the discussion of bike lanes noone mentioned Santa
Monica. I bike my children to school and then bike to work (2 miles).
If it weren't for the bike lanes, I wouldn't do it. I don't like
riding in traffic. It's very dangerous.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/?q...57AArONFj&cp=2

Tell me, how many parents already let their kids go out and enjoy a
bike ride on our wild roads? C'mon, and please don't count those
within the "gated communities." The rich live in their own safe world,
you know.



  #5  
Old July 17th 08, 04:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
KingOfTheApes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,468
Default Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work

Let's see what happened in the jungle today...

Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work
Wednesday, July 16, 2008
FoxNews

A cancer survivor bicycling to work for the first time to save on gas
was shot and killed, according to Toledo police.

Police Capt. Ray Carroll said 46-year-old David Babcock was seen on a
street having a heated argument with another man before he was shot
around 5:30 a.m. Tuesday.

"(There were) two people arguing, yelling at each other, then the gun
shots went off," said Carroll. "We were given just a vague description
(of the suspect)."

Babcock was pronounced dead at an area hospital.

The coroner said Babcock took a bullet to the face that caused massive
bleeding and hampered his breathing.

Witnesses told police they saw a suspect run down a street in the
mostly residential neighborhood.

The shooter took a ring of keys from Babcock, according to MYFOX
Toledo.

No arrests have been made. Authorities don't know the motive for the
shooting.

Babcock survived surgery to remove a brain tumor 13 years ago. His
fiancée, Rene Long, said he had put lights on his bike and wore a
reflective vest so he would be safe on his inaugural, 8-mile ride to
his job at Fresh Products Inc., a maker of air fresheners.

"I was so proud of him. He couldn't wait to ride it to work. That was
his first day of riding it to work," Long said.

***

Are we drawing any lessons from this? I'd draw this lesson, IF YOU
DON'T HAVE THE PATIENCE OF BUDDHA AND THE GUN OF JOHN WAYNE, STAY
HOME. I've got neither.

These are points to bear in mind...

Too many guns out there.

Too much road rage.

Too little respect for cyclists.

Too many reckless drivers.

Too many indifferent policemen, authorities, etc.
  #6  
Old July 17th 08, 08:56 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
JNugent[_4_]
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Posts: 824
Default Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work

KingOfTheApes wrote:

Let's see what happened in the jungle today...


Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work
Wednesday, July 16, 2008
FoxNews


A cancer survivor bicycling to work for the first time to save on gas
was shot and killed, according to Toledo police.
Police Capt. Ray Carroll said 46-year-old David Babcock was seen on a
street having a heated argument with another man before he was shot
around 5:30 a.m. Tuesday.
"(There were) two people arguing, yelling at each other, then the gun
shots went off," said Carroll. "We were given just a vague description
(of the suspect)."
Babcock was pronounced dead at an area hospital.
The coroner said Babcock took a bullet to the face that caused massive
bleeding and hampered his breathing.


"Hampered his breathing"?

To say the least, clearly.

Witnesses told police they saw a suspect run down a street in the
mostly residential neighborhood.


"Run down the street"...

Not, you motice: "drove away down the street" (see below).

The shooter took a ring of keys from Babcock, according to MYFOX
Toledo.
No arrests have been made. Authorities don't know the motive for the
shooting.
Babcock survived surgery to remove a brain tumor 13 years ago. His
fiancée, Rene Long, said he had put lights on his bike and wore a
reflective vest so he would be safe on his inaugural, 8-mile ride to
his job at Fresh Products Inc., a maker of air fresheners.
"I was so proud of him. He couldn't wait to ride it to work. That was
his first day of riding it to work," Long said.


Are we drawing any lessons from this? I'd draw this lesson, IF YOU
DON'T HAVE THE PATIENCE OF BUDDHA AND THE GUN OF JOHN WAYNE, STAY
HOME. I've got neither.

These are points to bear in mind...
Too many guns out there.


That's there. Not here (though there may well be too many here as well).

Too much road rage.
Too little respect for cyclists.
Too many reckless drivers.
Too many indifferent policemen, authorities, etc.


There might be (in both countries), but there's nowt above to lead you
to that view - you'd have to arrive at it independently of the report of
the instant case.

Was there any evidence at all that the incident had anything to do with
bikes, road rage, cars or indifferent policemen? How do we know that the
assailant wasn't just, for instance, a cuckolded husband?
  #7  
Old July 17th 08, 09:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,uk.rec.cycling
Dave Larrington
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,069
Default bikes are too fast for sidewalks, and too slow for traffic lanes

In ,
Tom Sherman tweaked the Babbage-Engine to
tell us:
[rec.bicycle.rides snipped]

KingOfTheChickens wrote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
"I don't usually ride on the sidewalk because I like to ride faster
than 5mph. End of story."

This kid has a concern for pedestrians...

"If you're over 13 years old it is illegal to ride a bike on the
sidewalk, plus cyclists are being curtious to walkers and joggers but
most importantly road bikes are simply too fast for the sidewalk, a
crack or uneven section could be devastating. You just have to have
some patience and learn to pass with out nearly killing everyone."

But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).

Is this guy truly (and unreasonably) terrified of vehicles, or just an
anti-cycling troll?


He's an arsehole. Ignore him and perhaps he'll go away.

--
Dave Larrington
http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk
Where's the gin?


  #8  
Old July 17th 08, 02:52 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
Tim McNamara
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,855
Default Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work

In article ,
JNugent wrote:

KingOfTheApes wrote:

Let's see what happened in the jungle today...


Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work Wednesday,
July 16, 2008 FoxNews


A cancer survivor bicycling to work for the first time to save on
gas was shot and killed, according to Toledo police. Police Capt.
Ray Carroll said 46-year-old David Babcock was seen on a street
having a heated argument with another man before he was shot around
5:30 a.m. Tuesday. "(There were) two people arguing, yelling at
each other, then the gun shots went off," said Carroll. "We were
given just a vague description (of the suspect)." Babcock was
pronounced dead at an area hospital. The coroner said Babcock took
a bullet to the face that caused massive bleeding and hampered his
breathing.


"Hampered his breathing"?

To say the least, clearly.

Witnesses told police they saw a suspect run down a street in the
mostly residential neighborhood.


"Run down the street"...

Not, you motice: "drove away down the street" (see below).

The shooter took a ring of keys from Babcock, according to MYFOX
Toledo. No arrests have been made. Authorities don't know the
motive for the shooting. Babcock survived surgery to remove a brain
tumor 13 years ago. His fiancée, Rene Long, said he had put lights
on his bike and wore a reflective vest so he would be safe on his
inaugural, 8-mile ride to his job at Fresh Products Inc., a maker
of air fresheners. "I was so proud of him. He couldn't wait to ride
it to work. That was his first day of riding it to work," Long
said.


Are we drawing any lessons from this? I'd draw this lesson, IF YOU
DON'T HAVE THE PATIENCE OF BUDDHA AND THE GUN OF JOHN WAYNE, STAY
HOME. I've got neither.

These are points to bear in mind... Too many guns out there.


That's there. Not here (though there may well be too many here as
well).

Too much road rage. Too little respect for cyclists. Too many
reckless drivers. Too many indifferent policemen, authorities, etc.


There might be (in both countries), but there's nowt above to lead
you to that view - you'd have to arrive at it independently of the
report of the instant case.


Indeed. We all read these things through the filters of our assumptions
and prejudices. One could as easily come to alternate conclusions if
starting from a different world view. A local conceal-and-carry
advocate would probably say that if everybody carried guns, everyone
would be more considerate and polite to each other and there'd be fewer
such incidents.

It's part of what's called self-serving bias and it's part of human
nature. We interpret events to favor our preexisting beliefs.

Was there any evidence at all that the incident had anything to do
with bikes, road rage, cars or indifferent policemen? How do we know
that the assailant wasn't just, for instance, a cuckolded husband?


Statistically speaking, most murderers are people who know the victim
well or at least have some personal connection. Truly random murders
are fairly rare.
  #9  
Old July 17th 08, 03:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
KingOfTheApes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,468
Default Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work

On Jul 17, 3:56*am, JNugent wrote:
KingOfTheApes wrote:
Let's see what happened in the jungle today...
Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work
Wednesday, July 16, 2008
FoxNews
A cancer survivor bicycling to work for the first time to save on gas
was shot and killed, according to Toledo police.
Police Capt. Ray Carroll said 46-year-old David Babcock was seen on a
street having a heated argument with another man before he was shot
around 5:30 a.m. Tuesday.
"(There were) two people arguing, yelling at each other, then the gun
shots went off," said Carroll. "We were given just a vague description
(of the suspect)."
Babcock was pronounced dead at an area hospital.
The coroner said Babcock took a bullet to the face that caused massive
bleeding and hampered his breathing.


"Hampered his breathing"?

To say the least, clearly.

Witnesses told police they saw a suspect run down a street in the
mostly residential neighborhood.


"Run down the street"...

Not, you motice: "drove away down the street" (see below).





The shooter took a ring of keys from Babcock, according to MYFOX
Toledo.
No arrests have been made. Authorities don't know the motive for the
shooting.
Babcock survived surgery to remove a brain tumor 13 years ago. His
fiancée, Rene Long, said he had put lights on his bike and wore a
reflective vest so he would be safe on his inaugural, 8-mile ride to
his job at Fresh Products Inc., a maker of air fresheners.
"I was so proud of him. He couldn't wait to ride it to work. That was
his first day of riding it to work," Long said.
Are we drawing any lessons from this? I'd draw this lesson, IF YOU
DON'T HAVE THE PATIENCE OF BUDDHA AND THE GUN OF JOHN WAYNE, STAY
HOME. I've got neither.


These are points to bear in mind...
Too many guns out there.


That's there. Not here (though there may well be too many here as well).

Too much road rage.
Too little respect for cyclists.
Too many reckless drivers.
Too many indifferent policemen, authorities, etc.


There might be (in both countries), but there's nowt above to lead you
to that view - you'd have to arrive at it independently of the report of
the instant case.

Was there any evidence at all that the incident had anything to do with
bikes, road rage, cars or indifferent policemen? How do we know that the
assailant wasn't just, for instance, a cuckolded husband?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


I'm just using case "X" to prove that it's a jungle out there, but I
could use the Google News search and find many more.

But it's not what happens to you (it almost happened to me recently
with a "vigilante" blowing the horn to let me know to walk the bike on
the sidewalk of a bridge), it's that people live in FEAR of taking a
chance on a bike when they can do it in a cage. This accounts for the
ridiculous low % of people (.4%) who dare to commute by bike.

What I propose is that we fight this form of discrimination in an
ORGANIZED WAY. Otherwise we will keep being food for the sharks.

The organization is done around WEARABLE BANNERS, aka T-Shirts.

http://webspawner.com/users/bikeforpeace

  #10  
Old July 17th 08, 03:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,alt.planning.urban,rec.bicycles.soc,rec.bicycles.rides,uk.rec.cycling
KingOfTheApes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,468
Default Ohio Cancer Survivor Shot and Killed Bicycling to Work

On Jul 17, 4:13 am, "Dave Larrington"
wrote:
,
Tom Sherman tweaked the Babbage-Engine to
tell us:





[rec.bicycle.rides snipped]


KingOfTheChickens wrote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
"I don't usually ride on the sidewalk because I like to ride faster
than 5mph. End of story."


This kid has a concern for pedestrians...


"If you're over 13 years old it is illegal to ride a bike on the
sidewalk, plus cyclists are being curtious to walkers and joggers but
most importantly road bikes are simply too fast for the sidewalk, a
crack or uneven section could be devastating. You just have to have
some patience and learn to pass with out nearly killing everyone."


But the fact of the matter is that bikes are too fast for sidewalks,
and too slow for the traffic lanes. In other words, THERE'S NO PLACE
FOR BIKES (unless you are going super slow or super fast).


Is this guy truly (and unreasonably) terrified of vehicles, or just an
anti-cycling troll?


He's an arsehole. Ignore him and perhaps he'll go away.


I'll stop posting here when I don't see the need to fight bike
discrimination. Luckily for those who prefer to ignore the issues, I
have many issues to talk about, other areas where we too are the
bottom of the food chain.

COMING OUT OF THE JUNGLE
http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote1

For example, I propose a "Dutch Package," where issues normal to the
Dutch --gay rights, bike facilities, prostitution and marihuana-- are
discussed in less open societies.

'U.S. leads world in substance abuse, WHO finds'

"Countries with looser drug laws have lower rates of abuse"

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080701/hl_nm/drugs_who_dc

One more proposal: The $15 billion the US wastes on the "war on
drugs," could be smartly used to build BIKE FACILITIES.

 




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