Why heckling Page is Fair Game

On Dec 30, 9:13*pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article
,
*"Paul G." wrote:



On Dec 29, 5:04*pm, Fred Fredburger
wrote:
Bill C wrote:
On Dec 29, 6:10 pm, Amit Ghosh wrote:

dumbass,

i am sick of these "emotional" tough guys like phil moore and kunich
who want to beat up people who insult them on the internet.

these are the same types of guys that get into shoving matches at
bars, stalk ex-girlfriends and eventually put a barrel of a shotgun in
their mouth.

I'm also sick of loud mothed assholes screaming out garbage,
disrupting others people's right to speak, ruining others people's
events to stroke their sad little egos. Your right to be an asshole
ends at my right to conduct my life and business. I'd love to come up
there where I'm guessing you teach some classes and scream throught
them about how you plagiarized a bunch of your papers, insinuate you
molest little boys, and all kinds of other garbage with NO
repercussions for my actions at all.
*A race, like any other sanctioned sporting event is controlled by the
organizing body, it's not a public area. It's a private event where
the public is allowed access. With that come certain standards of
behavior, especially where they could damage the product, as this
asshole did.
*Bill C

Behaving like a civilized human being is a good thing. But it's also
cool for people to grow the **** up and quit taking offense at every
little thing. In the KC incident, nothing McAnus said or did excuses
violence on the part of the Page Clan.

The fact that so many of you absolve the Page Clan of responsibility for
the fight they willingly participated in IS CRAZY. The fight caused far
more damage to the sport than 50 hecklers would have.

You usually seem like a reasonable guy. Where are you getting this
idea that the Page Clan "willingly participated" in the fight? *They
unwisely confronted McAnus about disrupting the interview, but that is
hardly "willingly participating" in the fight.

Maybe they were annoying. Maybe Book actually did touch McAnus. None
of that excuses the assault shown in the video, or changes the fact
that Book is CLEARLY NOT a willing participant. He's shown lying on
his back and trying to get away, while McAnus and his pal repeatedly
go after him.

Marquess of Queensberry rules? This is a fight.
Get the other guy down and keep him down until he pules.

--
Michael Press

Shrug. I guess someone could have pulled a gun. Would that make you
happy? That would "keep him down" for a long time.

One good thing coming out of this is it's educational. Looks like the
rules are pretty strict regarding fighting. There's nothing like a
good old-fashioned crucifixion to get the natives to settle down.
-Paul

In article
,
"Paul G." wrote:

On Dec 30, 9:13*pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article
,
*"Paul G." wrote:



On Dec 29, 5:04*pm, Fred Fredburger
wrote:
Bill C wrote:
On Dec 29, 6:10 pm, Amit Ghosh wrote:

dumbass,

i am sick of these "emotional" tough guys like phil moore and kunich
who want to beat up people who insult them on the internet.

these are the same types of guys that get into shoving matches at
bars, stalk ex-girlfriends and eventually put a barrel of a shotgun in
their mouth.

I'm also sick of loud mothed assholes screaming out garbage,
disrupting others people's right to speak, ruining others people's
events to stroke their sad little egos. Your right to be an asshole
ends at my right to conduct my life and business. I'd love to come up
there where I'm guessing you teach some classes and scream throught
them about how you plagiarized a bunch of your papers, insinuate you
molest little boys, and all kinds of other garbage with NO
repercussions for my actions at all.
*A race, like any other sanctioned sporting event is controlled by the
organizing body, it's not a public area. It's a private event where
the public is allowed access. With that come certain standards of
behavior, especially where they could damage the product, as this
asshole did.
*Bill C

Behaving like a civilized human being is a good thing. But it's also
cool for people to grow the **** up and quit taking offense at every
little thing. In the KC incident, nothing McAnus said or did excuses
violence on the part of the Page Clan.

The fact that so many of you absolve the Page Clan of responsibility for
the fight they willingly participated in IS CRAZY. The fight caused far
more damage to the sport than 50 hecklers would have.

You usually seem like a reasonable guy. Where are you getting this
idea that the Page Clan "willingly participated" in the fight? *They
unwisely confronted McAnus about disrupting the interview, but that is
hardly "willingly participating" in the fight.

Maybe they were annoying. Maybe Book actually did touch McAnus. None
of that excuses the assault shown in the video, or changes the fact
that Book is CLEARLY NOT a willing participant. He's shown lying on
his back and trying to get away, while McAnus and his pal repeatedly
go after him.

Marquess of Queensberry rules? This is a fight.
Get the other guy down and keep him down until he pules.

Shrug. I guess someone could have pulled a gun. Would that make you
happy? That would "keep him down" for a long time.

Where do you get that?

One good thing coming out of this is it's educational. Looks like the
rules are pretty strict regarding fighting. There's nothing like a
good old-fashioned crucifixion to get the natives to settle down.

This is why I never get into fights.
Everybody seems to think there are rules.
I don't.

--
Michael Press

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...
In article ,
Donald Munro wrote:

Amit Ghosh wrote:
i work in a high stress environment where heckling and verbal
abuse can be at a level that would wither 90% of people. thin skinned
crybabies that can't adapt just end up leaving.

You get paid to post to rbr ?

He's a high school teacher.

Proof of why high school testing is showing a sharp drop in knowledge?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

On Dec 30, 8:00*am, Bill C wrote:

Sorry Ben you're wrong on what could happen at a race.
*McA was, and is a licensed racer, at a USAC event, an official
could've done anything up to having him removed and suspended. It's
not routine, but happens commonly that riders are warned for their
language where spectators, or press can hear it, and can be, and have
been fined for it. If he didn't stop that gets into disregarding an
Officials order and that's another can of worms. We go through this
with helmets all the time. If you hold a license, and are at an event,
you MUST wear a helmet at all times, not just when you are racing,
same goes for the rest of the code of conduct. Generally an official
is not going to go looking for this stuff, but during a post race
interview, which is clearly part of the event, they would become
involved.
*That goes along with having signed the contract for your license,
same as the doping stuff. Mc A was both liable for action both under
the USAC rulebook, and under the civil police. As were the Pages.
Gonna be interesting to see how this all shakes out.
*There's the "penalize the person who caused the issue" theory, and
then there's the "What's more serious" theory, but either way USAC
should, based on past performance, issue some suspensions here at a
minimum. The only thing that might save them was that none of this was
apparently witnessed by an official.
*Bill C
*Bill C

Yes but your role in the blue-blazer mafia
is to protect the sport, not the "product" as in
the promoter's publicity interests. I know that
is a fine distinction, but it is there. You can
sanction a licensed rider for peeing on
somebody's lawn (which is a far greater harm
to the sport than heckling interviews). USAC
suspended Mercer after he clubbed Myerson,
and nobody had a problem with that.

But USAC's rules don't trump free expression
by spectators. Spectators should behave
themselves because we live in a civilized
society and all that. However, the sidewalk
at a race is still a more open forum than, for
example, the stands at a football game.
That is all that I was saying.

Ben

On Dec 31, 12:36*am, "
wrote:
On Dec 30, 8:00*am, Bill C wrote:







Sorry Ben you're wrong on what could happen at a race.
*McA was, and is a licensed racer, at a USAC event, an official
could've done anything up to having him removed and suspended. It's
not routine, but happens commonly that riders are warned for their
language where spectators, or press can hear it, and can be, and have
been fined for it. If he didn't stop that gets into disregarding an
Officials order and that's another can of worms. We go through this
with helmets all the time. If you hold a license, and are at an event,
you MUST wear a helmet at all times, not just when you are racing,
same goes for the rest of the code of conduct. Generally an official
is not going to go looking for this stuff, but during a post race
interview, which is clearly part of the event, they would become
involved.
*That goes along with having signed the contract for your license,
same as the doping stuff. Mc A was both liable for action both under
the USAC rulebook, and under the civil police. As were the Pages.
Gonna be interesting to see how this all shakes out.
*There's the "penalize the person who caused the issue" theory, and
then there's the "What's more serious" theory, but either way USAC
should, based on past performance, issue some suspensions here at a
minimum. The only thing that might save them was that none of this was
apparently witnessed by an official.
*Bill C
*Bill C

Yes but your role in the blue-blazer mafia
is to protect the sport, not the "product" as in
the promoter's publicity interests. *I know that
is a fine distinction, but it is there. *You can
sanction a licensed rider for peeing on
somebody's lawn (which is a far greater harm
to the sport than heckling interviews). *USAC
suspended Mercer after he clubbed Myerson,
and nobody had a problem with that.

But USAC's rules don't trump free expression
by spectators. *Spectators should behave
themselves because we live in a civilized
society and all that. *However, the sidewalk
at a race is still a more open forum than, for
example, the stands at a football game.
That is all that I was saying.



Dumbass -


In the stands at a football game they say a lot worse than the "screw
you and your momma" that McAnich was yelling.

Much, much worse.

It's harmless, unless someone decides to be an even bigger ass.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

"Paul G." wrote:

On Dec 30, 2:56Ýpm, "Paul G." wrote:
On Dec 30, 12:39Ýpm, Donald Munro wrote:

Bill C wrote:
I'd drop a couple of E-mails but I'm betting that noone would touch this
until they absolutely have to. I'd lean towards Mc A could be held
accountable just by virtue of being a license holder at an event
regardless of whether he raced or not that day. I know we've done it with
helmets.

If Page had been wearing a helmet none of this would have happened.

I dunno about that... here is the blow by blow description of the
OTHER fight at KC. Enjoy!

ÝMyerson described how the incident with Baker unfolded.

Same guy got punched in the head back in 2000. The consequences for
the puncher were seve
http://www.kenpapai.com/cycling/rbr/adamsStitches.html

That was done by the Scott Mercer Terminator.

Magilla

Kurgan Gringioni wrote:

On Dec 31, 12:36*am, "
wrote:
On Dec 30, 8:00*am, Bill C wrote:







Sorry Ben you're wrong on what could happen at a race.
*McA was, and is a licensed racer, at a USAC event, an official
could've done anything up to having him removed and suspended. It's
not routine, but happens commonly that riders are warned for their
language where spectators, or press can hear it, and can be, and have
been fined for it. If he didn't stop that gets into disregarding an
Officials order and that's another can of worms. We go through this
with helmets all the time. If you hold a license, and are at an event,
you MUST wear a helmet at all times, not just when you are racing,
same goes for the rest of the code of conduct. Generally an official
is not going to go looking for this stuff, but during a post race
interview, which is clearly part of the event, they would become
involved.
*That goes along with having signed the contract for your license,
same as the doping stuff. Mc A was both liable for action both under
the USAC rulebook, and under the civil police. As were the Pages.
Gonna be interesting to see how this all shakes out.
*There's the "penalize the person who caused the issue" theory, and
then there's the "What's more serious" theory, but either way USAC
should, based on past performance, issue some suspensions here at a
minimum. The only thing that might save them was that none of this was
apparently witnessed by an official.
*Bill C
*Bill C

Yes but your role in the blue-blazer mafia
is to protect the sport, not the "product" as in
the promoter's publicity interests. *I know that
is a fine distinction, but it is there. *You can
sanction a licensed rider for peeing on
somebody's lawn (which is a far greater harm
to the sport than heckling interviews). *USAC
suspended Mercer after he clubbed Myerson,
and nobody had a problem with that.

But USAC's rules don't trump free expression
by spectators. *Spectators should behave
themselves because we live in a civilized
society and all that. *However, the sidewalk
at a race is still a more open forum than, for
example, the stands at a football game.
That is all that I was saying.

Dumbass -

In the stands at a football game they say a lot worse than the "screw
you and your momma" that McAnich was yelling.

Much, much worse.

It's harmless, unless someone decides to be an even bigger ass.

thanks,

K. Gringioni.

Notice how you don't see the wives of baseball players trying to suppress all
the hecklers at every game. This is not uncharted waters.

Thanks,

Magilla

MagillaGorilla wrote:
That was done by the Scott Mercer Terminator.

Another SchwartzSoft prototype that went rogue.

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...
In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

Proof of why high school testing is showing a sharp drop in knowledge?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect

High school testing has shown that only a third of high school students can
read to their grade levels. Math is preposterous. The No Child Left Behind
testing scores are now being hidden by local school boards mostly out of
abject embarrassment.

" wrote in message
...

USAC suspended Mercer after he clubbed Myerson,
and nobody had a problem with that.

There's a difference between competitors fighting and some sideline jerk
purposely starting a fight usually because he's too drunk to know what the
hell he's doing.

But USAC's rules don't trump free expression
by spectators. Spectators should behave
themselves because we live in a civilized
society and all that. However, the sidewalk
at a race is still a more open forum than, for
example, the stands at a football game.

Screaming insults in a direct attempt to disturb an interview is another
matter altogether.