For Coggan and Coyle

B. Lafferty wrote:
And we now know from Armstrong's testimony that he lost a kilo, not the
7 or 8 kilos

Andy Coggan wrote:
So let's see: 83 mL/min/kg x 74 kg = a VO2max of 6.14 L/min. That's
essentially identical to Chris Boardman's VO2max, yet Boardman's race
weight was only 68-69 kg. Are you now going to argue that Boardman was
also a doper?

B. Lafferty wrote:
And how did Boardman do climbing in the Tour?

Coming soon:
Lafferty vs Coggan rbr deathmatch.
Format: ITT or boxing match
Date: To be decided
Admission price: 1 Cadbury slab

Donald Munro wrote:
B. Lafferty wrote:
Andy Coggan wrote:
B. Lafferty wrote:

Coming soon:
Lafferty vs Coggan rbr deathmatch.
Format: ITT or boxing match
Date: To be decided
Admission price: 1 Cadbury slab

No no no. The Lafferty vs Coggan deathmatch will be run at
the next Low-Key Hillclimb, but instead of climbing the hill,
they will duke it out by attempting to guess Dan Connelly's
weight. (Like one of those guess-how-many-jellybeans
contests.) As a tie breaker, they will use his weight and HCT
to predict his Old La Honda time. Admission will still be one
Cadbury bar/person, and all proceeds will be donated to
a charity, namely Dan Connelly (who needs some fattening
up to qualify to post in rbr).

Ben
Event Promoter

wrote:
B. Lafferty wrote:

And we now know from Armstrong's testimony that he lost a kilo, not the 7
or 8 kilos

No, we don't know that, because we don't know at what mass Armstrong
was before he got down to 74 kg and change.

So let's see: 83 mL/min/kg x 74 kg = a VO2max of 6.14 L/min. That's
essentially identical to Chris Boardman's VO2max, yet Boardman's race
weight was only 68-69 kg. Are you now going to argue that Boardman was
also a doper? How about Obree (VO2max = 88 mL/min/kg, mass similar to
Boardman's)?

Andy Coggan

Andy,


On a related topic, do you have any data on Lemond? I always wondered
why all those doped up pro's who spent hours in wind tunnels on much
more aerodynmaically advanced bikes could never pick off his Tour TT
record. He seems to be the king of circumstantial evidence and I always
found it kind of funny that he never saw the hipocrasy.

I always wondered
why all those doped up pro's who spent hours in wind tunnels on much
more aerodynmaically advanced bikes could never pick off his Tour TT
record. He seems to be the king of circumstantial evidence and I always
found it kind of funny that he never saw the hipocrasy.

Didn't he have a big tail-wind on a point-to-point course?

I'm pretty sure Verbrugghe held or even still holds the prologue speed
record b/c of an uncomplicated point-to-point parcours and a big tail
wind.

B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
ps.com...
B. Lafferty wrote:

And we now know from Armstrong's testimony that he lost a kilo, not the
7
or 8 kilos

No, we don't know that, because we don't know at what mass Armstrong
was before he got down to 74 kg and change.

Keep dancing, Andy. Lets talk about weight. It's quite clear now that
Armstrong and his minions were misrepresenting how much weight he lost
post-cancer.

And that matters because...?

So let's see: 83 mL/min/kg x 74 kg = a VO2max of 6.14 L/min. That's
essentially identical to Chris Boardman's VO2max, yet Boardman's race
weight was only 68-69 kg. Are you now going to argue that Boardman was
also a doper? How about Obree (VO2max = 88 mL/min/kg, mass similar to
Boardman's)?

And how did Boardman do climbing in the Tour?

How well did Armstrong perform in the pursuit, or for that matter, the
hour record? The answer is that he never even attempted them, because
he knew that even the hour might be beyond his reach. IOW, there are
horses for courses, and simply having a high VO2max doesn't guarantee
anything.

Andy Coggan

wrote:

do you have any data on Lemond?

Nope. The closest I've been to Lemond is racing against him (quite
unsuccessfully, as you can imagine...then again, I'm not the only one
who might say that!) at the 1977 Junior World team trials in/around
Princeton, NJ, and the 1980 Olympic Trials in west central Ohio.

Andy Coggan

wrote:
I always wondered
why all those doped up pro's who spent hours in wind tunnels on much
more aerodynmaically advanced bikes could never pick off his Tour TT
record. He seems to be the king of circumstantial evidence and I always
found it kind of funny that he never saw the hipocrasy.

Didn't he have a big tail-wind on a point-to-point course?

Don't forget the slight downhill.

I'm pretty sure Verbrugghe held or even still holds the prologue speed
record b/c of an uncomplicated point-to-point parcours and a big tail
wind.

55 X 11

http://au.cyclingnews.com/results/20...prologue.shtml

Bob Schwartz

wrote in message
oups.com...
B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
ps.com...
B. Lafferty wrote:

And we now know from Armstrong's testimony that he lost a kilo, not
the
7
or 8 kilos

No, we don't know that, because we don't know at what mass Armstrong
was before he got down to 74 kg and change.

Keep dancing, Andy. Lets talk about weight. It's quite clear now that
Armstrong and his minions were misrepresenting how much weight he lost
post-cancer.

And that matters because...?

Why do you think Armstong and his camp keep repeating the false weight
mantra year after year.

So let's see: 83 mL/min/kg x 74 kg = a VO2max of 6.14 L/min. That's
essentially identical to Chris Boardman's VO2max, yet Boardman's race
weight was only 68-69 kg. Are you now going to argue that Boardman was
also a doper? How about Obree (VO2max = 88 mL/min/kg, mass similar to
Boardman's)?

And how did Boardman do climbing in the Tour?

How well did Armstrong perform in the pursuit, or for that matter, the
hour record?

So you really don't know the answer to your strawman and never will.


...The answer is that he never even attempted them, because
he knew that even the hour might be beyond his reach.

Is that why he never attempted the Hour? Cite please, or are you just
speculating?


.. IOW, there are
horses for courses, and simply having a high VO2max doesn't guarantee
anything.

But without a high VO2max you'll never be a great climber at 74 kilos. Now
define high for us in this context.

Andy Coggan

B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
ps.com...
B. Lafferty wrote:

And we now know from Armstrong's testimony that he lost a kilo, not
the
7
or 8 kilos

No, we don't know that, because we don't know at what mass Armstrong
was before he got down to 74 kg and change.

Keep dancing, Andy. Lets talk about weight. It's quite clear now that
Armstrong and his minions were misrepresenting how much weight he lost
post-cancer.

And that matters because...?

Why do you think Armstong and his camp keep repeating the false weight
mantra year after year.

Objection, your honor: assuming facts not in evidence. ;-)

We don't know that it's a "false mantra", since we don't really know
what Armstrong weighed when, e.g., he won Worlds in his pre-cancer
days. But even if you accept that wasn't much heavier than the 74 kg
that he stated under oath was his Tour-winning weight, there are
alternative explanations as to why he would exaggerate how much weight
he lost/how strict he was about controlling his energy intake.
Remember, this is a guy who was very much into playing head games.

So let's see: 83 mL/min/kg x 74 kg = a VO2max of 6.14 L/min. That's
essentially identical to Chris Boardman's VO2max, yet Boardman's race
weight was only 68-69 kg. Are you now going to argue that Boardman was
also a doper? How about Obree (VO2max = 88 mL/min/kg, mass similar to
Boardman's)?

And how did Boardman do climbing in the Tour?

How well did Armstrong perform in the pursuit, or for that matter, the
hour record?

So you really don't know the answer to your strawman and never will.

My question to you was really rhetorical in nature.

(Oh, and BTW: Boardman was British hillclimb champion early in his
career, and acquitted himself reasonably well in a few mountainous TdF
stages...he just couldn't keep it up day-after-day-after-day.)

..The answer is that he never even attempted them, because
he knew that even the hour might be beyond his reach.

Is that why he never attempted the Hour? Cite please, or are you just
speculating?

Armstrong seriously considered attempting the hour, or at least
seriously enough to put together a whole "Formula 1" team for the
effort. After conducting some wind tunnel tests in San Diego, though,
he bagged the idea...and in the audio of some Discovery Channel
coverage someone can be overheard basically telling him "you can't do
it".

Pics of Armstrong's trip to the San Diego wind tunnel can be found
he

http://www.trainright.com/galleries....play&record=11

. IOW, there are
horses for courses, and simply having a high VO2max doesn't guarantee
anything.

But without a high VO2max you'll never be a great climber at 74 kilos. Now
define high for us in this context.

I don't know how high is high enough, but clearly Armstrong's VO2max
was adequate.

Andy Coggan

B. Lafferty wrote:
"Fred Fredburger" wrote in message
. ..
B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

B. Lafferty wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

B. Lafferty wrote:

Conclusion de Michael Ashenden : "Aucun doute possible : il a utilisé
des
produits dopants à un moment donné."
DUMBASS,

THIS IS NOT EVIDENCE OF DOPING.

Incorrect. It is circumstantial evidence. The weight of circumstantial
evidence of doping continues to grow.
dumbass,

nothing in this line of "analysis" -- based on physical parameters and
crude calculations -- connects LANCE to drugs.

if you tried to present this as "circumstantial evidence", the other
side would strip you naked,

the best circumstantial evidence against lance is from swart and from
potentially other teamates (like the andreu vaughters IMs).

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Beleive in any fantasy you like such as Armstong and USPS being a clean
team.
And that is quite clearly NOT what was said.

Yada, yada, yada.

Believe in any fantasy you like such as anyone disagreeing with you being
guilty of cannibalism.

ROTFL!



Didn't your mother teach you not to laugh when you have your mouth full?